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Mister C Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 20 Jan 2003 Posts: 3296 City: Burbank, SO-CAL
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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I dont see anything... _________________ "I knew those girls were pros, but don't tell Turtle, it'll break his heart." - Drama, Entourage |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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Creatine FAQ by Icex999
"I know that creatine with dextrose is good as a part of an after workout shake, but how about on rest days when you are just trying to keep the creatine level up in the blood. Ya still have to mix it with dextrose or whatever? Seems like some unnessesary calories if ya don't need it." - gbat
Yes, you're right it is indeed unneccesary calories. As a general rule of thumb, creatine should only be mixed with dextrose post-workout. Insulin is one of the most anabolic hormones produced by the body, but it is also one of the most fattening hormones produced by the body. After a workout, the insulin spike drives more creatine into the muscles and most of the sugar (dextrose in this case) is shunted towards muscle + liver glycogen resynthesis. However, when not taken post-workout, all that extra sugar will probably end up in your adipose cells, unless you're in a fasted state. So to sum things up, on rest days, just take creatine by itself
"I am a creatine non responder. I heard that swole and V12 might work. Be4 I try one, has any non responder of regular creatine powder tried swole or V12? Which did you try and did you respond to it?" - asianlifter
Although the jury is still out on which of these products is the best of the two, so far lots of positive feedback has been coming in on both products. Many creatine non-responders say that these products worked great for them, so either one is recommended. A recent article in Flex magazine stated that this may be because of the glycocyamine content of each of these products. If you can find glycocyamine by itself, adding 3 grams of it to 5 grams of a plain, micronized creatine would actually be the best thing to do.
"I have been takin creatine for about 2 months now and have seen great gains in both stregth and also musclemass...When i stop this cycle in about a week, will i start to lose eitha the muscle or the stregth..I heard there has been debate about this. My friend says as soon as i go off it the water will be released and i will lose mass and stregth......" -
|||Bonez|||
Although this topic hasn't been researched yet, here is the general agreement between those 'in the know'. Your strength will decrease, but nothing to worry about. You will still probably be able to lift heavier weights that what you were lifting when you started creatine. You will also lose a little bit of size, all of it water retention, nothing significant enough to be worried about it.
"I dont have any grape juice, is it ok to load it with water?" -dixie945466
Yes, it's fine to take creatine with water. Actually, as stated in the first question, I believe that the only time you should take creatine with sugar is post-workout.
"Is it possible to sniff creatine and get the same effects as drinking it? just wondering. im not really thinking of doing but im curious." - tre14
Yes, you COULD snort creatine, but the effects wouldn't be the same as drinking it. Most particles of creatine dust are just too big to make it through the nasal cavity into the blood stream. Even micronized creatine might be too large. This subject has never been researched, and I doubt it ever will be so I can't give you a solid answer. All I can say is, if you decide to snort it, it's a stupid idea, but best of luck! Keep 911 on speed dial just in case you congested to the point of suffocation....
"If dextrose is like table sugar then would it be ok to take my creating in my coffee?"
-WanaKnowMore
Dextrose isn't like table sugar. Dextrose has higher glycemic index than table sugar, which means it spikes your blood sugar faster and higher which in turn leads to more insulin being released, which will drive the creatine into your muscles. The coffee leads us to our next question....
"Will consuming caffeine while on creatine affect my results?"
The answer to this one is yes and no. Recent research on the topic has shown that caffeine affects the performance enhancing benefits of creatine. Therefore if you're taking creatine to get stronger or faster, then limit your caffeine intake while on creatine. However, consuming caffeine while on creatine does not affect the cell-volumizing aspect of the supplement. So if you're taking it to get bigger, taking it with caffeine is fine.
"Will creatine make my balls shrink/give me gynecomastia (man breasts)?" - Countless
Newbies
No. The only things that do these dastardly deeds are things that act as external sources of testosterone, such as steroids and pro-hormones.
"ok i know that when you are taking creatine you need to drink alot of water but i was wondering that if i was just to drink about a gallon of water at night and only a little during the day would that be the same as spreading 2 gallons out throughout the whole day?"
- brianSP
Taking your water this way wouldn't affect your creatine results at all. However, I'd recommend drinking the water throughout the day as a constant water consumption throughout the day provides optimal hydration.
"Is german creatine superior to non-german creatine?"
Yes, but this is mainly because german creatine is micronized. Any kind of micronized creatine would do just fine.
"Which supplements brands use german creatine?" -Thi@go.
Anything that is labelled as creapure contains German creatine. Some companies may also state that their creatine is german, which is an obvious giveaway.
"How long is it ok for creatine to be in water?" - TranceNRG
If the water is pure (ph=7) and 4 degrees C, then 30 days. In pure water at 25 degrees C, 3 days. Even at a water pH of 3.5, it is 97.5% stable after 3 hours. (Answer courtesy of K(same))
Does anyone know how long you can be off of creatine without having to do another loading phase? -coconut
1-2 weeks.
"I want to take creatine, but I have heard that once you start taking creating for an extended period of time that your body doesn't produce its own creatine after a while and your weak during that period. Is this true or can I start loading?" - BigBryan1
Your body will continue to produce its own creatine. Go ahead and start your creatine.
"Ok, I have read articles that advocate taking Creatine with juice, and some articles that Juice works against the Creatine.
So the question is, is either side correct, or is it even known how to take the Creatine?"
-CMM
The side that advocated taking creatine with juice is right (grape is best). Although this isn't the best way to take creatine, it won't 'work against the creatine'.
"I've started taking it for the first time. It's not easy to take though. It makes me feel sick and 15 minutes after taking it I stuff like an elephant. Is this normal? I am taking doses of 15-30g as recommended by the manufacturer as a loading phase." -itch
It is not normal to have to have gastrointestinal problems with creatine. Your stomach obviously isn't agreeing with such a huge dose of creatine. The loading phase isn't even necessary, so just drop down to a 'maintenance level' of 3-5 grams of creatine per day.
"Well, I just started bulking about 14 weeks ago and I've gained about 25 lbs with the help of creatine. Though I'd like to gain more, I'm starting to outgrow my pants, so I've decided to start cutting.
Should continue taking creatine? " - Gravity
Taking creatine while cutting is fine, and I'd actually reccommend it if you saw positive results from it while bulking. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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Glycocyamine – Is it a "Creatine-Enhancer?"
by Paul Cribb, B.H.Sci HMS
AST Director of Research
You many have read about a new compound called glycocyamine in the muscle magazines. Some supplement marketers are selling this product as a creatine enhancer.
What is Glycocyamine?
Glycocyamine is the intermediate step of creatine synthesis in the liver. It is often called guanidinoacetate. The first step in creatine synthesis occurs with the transfer of the amidino group of arginine to glycine to yield ornithine and guanidinoacetate via L-arginine:glycine amidinotransferase.[1]
Because of this, glycocyamine (guanidinoacetate) is often used in medical research as a marker for alterations in creatine metabolism and an indicator of conditions such as arginine-glycine amidinotransferase (AGAT) and guanidinoacetate methyltransferase (GAMT) deficiencies.[2,3]
A reduction of guanidinoacetic acid in body fluids is desired for GAMT deficiency (an inborn error of creatine biosynthesis). These diseases are characterized by creatine depletion and accumulation of guanidinoacetate in the brain.[4]
Glycocyamine as a Supplement.
There are no direct studies on glycocyamine as a performance enhancing supplement or a creatine enhancer. Even more important to athletes, there is no theoretical research that even remotely suggests glycocyamine might enhance muscle growth or the effectiveness of creatine supplementation.
One study has examined the effects of supplementing with glycocyamine and creatine on physiological plasma homocysteine levels in rats.[5] It’s from this research that marketers of glycocyamine supplements seem to be drawing their “science-based” sales pitch on glycocyamine.
A number of studies have confirmed a relationship between an increased plasma concentration of homocysteine and the development of cardiovascular disease. Even a small increase in circulating homocysteine increases coronary artery disease risk by 60% for men and 80% for women.[6] Supplementation with creatine is suspected to decrease homocysteine levels.[7]
Because the methylation of guanidinoacetate to creatine via consumes more S-adenosylmethionine than all other methylation reactions combined, the researchers behind the rat study hypothesized that guanidinoacetate and creatine supplementation may have opposite effects on homocysteine levels. Results showed they did.[5] Creatine supplementation was shown to decrease liver homocysteine levels, thus substantiating the possibility of creatine as a supplement that may help people avoid cardiovascular disease. However, guanidinoacetate supplementation was shown to increase homocysteine levels. This is not a good thing if you want to reduce your risk of cardiovascular disease.[6]
Would glycocyamine be effective for bodybuilders?
To provide a theoretical answer this question, we must look at glycocyamine’s role in metabolism and the role of creatine supplementation. Firstly, remember that glycocyamine is an intermediate involved in creatine synthesis within the liver. Without the presence of supplementation the body only synthesizes a small amount of creatine (less than 2-grams) per day. However, from the research it is clear that creatine supplementation reduces the body’s need to synthesize creatine, therefore the role of glycocyamine would be virtually eliminated.[7]
Secondly, compare this to regular doses that bodybuilders supplement (5-20-grams per day). Glycocyamine has no biochemical role what so ever in creatine supplementation and accumulation in muscle. Therefore you can start to understand why glycocyamine would be fairly useless supplement for bodybuilders.
Finally, as muscle cells cannot manufacture creatine, any attempt to increase muscle glycocyamine content via supplementation in an effort to help increase creatine stores would obviously be useless. Also, creatine relies on a highly selective cell transporter, I can’t see how a non-insulin-stimulating compound like glycocyamine could enhance creatine uptake in muscle.
The bottom line . . .
Guanidinoacetate/glycocyamine’s role in the small amount of creatine synthesized by the body has nothing to do with creatine supplementation. Promoting glycocyamine as a supplement that enhances the effects of creatine supplementation is completely without practical or theoretical biological evidence.
While at present there is zero research on guanidinoacetate/glycocyamine’s effect on muscle growth or creatine supplementation, from a theoretical perspective, as I have shown you, I can’t see how glycocyamine supplementation would enhance the effectiveness of creatine supplementation.
It’s becoming commonplace in the supplement industry for marketers to select a little known obscure metabolite from biochemistry (it doesn't matter if the compound is completely irrelevant to bodybuilding), and hype it as a new “magic muscle building catalyst”. This seems to occur because supplement marketers are all too aware that bodybuilders are demanding science-based products.
The problem with this unscrupulous marketing approach is that it’s very difficult for anyone without a biochemistry major to decipher the “science” behind these bogus products (even then, most acedemics still can’t see through the smoke screen). What you can do as a consumer is ask to be provided with the full reports on the research cited. Ask for the clear facts and don’t be intimidated or impressed by scientific marketing spin.
From a research and theoretically-based perspective, the suggestion that glycocyamine is a creatine-enhancing supplement is at present, completely unfounded.
References:
1. Allain, P, LeBouil A, Cordillet E, LeQuay L, Bagheri H, and Montastruc JL. Sulfate and cysteine levels in the plasma of patients with Parkinson's Disease. Neurotoxicol 16: 527–530, 1995.
2. Carducci C, Birarelli M, Leuzzi V, Carducci C, Battini R, Cioni G, Antonozzi I Clin Chem 2002 Oct;48(10):1772-8. Guanidinoacetate and creatine plus creatinine assessment in physiologic fluids: an effective diagnostic tool for the biochemical diagnosis of arginine:glycine amidinotransferase and guanidinoacetate methyltransferase deficiencies. Clin Chem 2002 Oct; 48(10):1772–8.
3. Al Banchaabouchi M, Marescau B, Van Marck E, D'hooge R, De Deyn PP. Long-term effect of partial nephrectomy on biological parameters, kidney histology, and guanidino compound levels in mice. Metabolism 2001 Dec; 50(12):1418-25.
4. Schulze A, Ebinger F, Rating D, Mayatepek E. Improving treatment of guanidinoacetate methyltransferase deficiency: reduction of guanidinoacetic acid in body fluids by arginine restriction and ornithine supplementation. Mol Genet Metab 2001 Dec;74(4):413-9.
5. Lori M. Stead, Keegan P. Au, René L. Jacobs, Margaret E. Brosnan, and John T. Brosnan. Methylation demand and homocysteine metabolism: effects of dietary provision of creatine and guanidinoacetate. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab 281: E1095–E1100, 2001
6. Refsum, H, Ueland PM, Nygård O, and Vollset SE. Homocysteine and cardiovascular disease. Annu Rev Med 49: 31-62, 1998.
7. M. F. McCarty. Supplemental creatine may decrease serum homocysteine and abolish the homocysteine `gender gap' by suppressing endogenous creatine synthesis. Med Hypotheses. Jan; 56(1): 5-7,2001. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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CREATINE AND GROWTH HORMONE
Since creatine increases our exercise capacity, and exercise increases hormone release, it is expected that creatine should also indirectly increase the amounts of anabolic hormones produced while exercising. Indeed, one recent study has possibly demonstrated this predicted effect. Surprisingly, however, in this study Growth Hormone release was observed in non-exercising subjects after ingesting creatine. In other words, just taking creatine was sufficient to increase Growth Hormone production.
The Study: Six males were given a breakfast of 20 grams of creatine monohydrate dissolved in a half-liter of hot water. They were then told to limit their activity (but not fall asleep!) for the rest of the morning. For six hours their blood was monitored at intervals for the presence of creatine and Growth Hormone. As expected, blood creatine levels rose within minutes of taking creatine monohydrate. Blood Growth Hormone levels, on the other hand, required about 2 hours before rising. This lag indicates that the release of Growth Hormone depends on other cellular events occurring first. Growth Hormone increased on average ~80% over baseline values. Albeit provocative, this finding needs to be viewed with caution until corroborated by other studies.
What are the implications of this study?
This study suggests that creatine may have an anabolic property independent from its ability to increase exercise intensity. This result may also explain why some studies have shown that muscle cells raised in "tissue culture" (out side of the animal in plastic dishes) increase their production of muscle proteins when exposed to creatine. As were the subjects in the previously mentioned study, these muscle cells were inactive due to their growth conditions.
Another unexplained observation is why creatine appears to be less effective in the elderly. This situation may be partially explained by the decline in Growth Hormone levels in the aged. In other words, part of the benefit of creatine might be absent in elderly persons with less Growth Hormone. Time will tell if these assumptions are right. We'll just have to wait.
Problems with the Study
Firstly, since these experiments were conducted on a relatively young (~23 years of age) and healthy set of subjects, it is not known whether these findings also apply to the elderly and ill.
Secondly, the sample size was small (six) and the individual responses to creatine varied widely. Three showed strong increases in Growth Hormone levels, two had moderate to low increases in Growth Hormone, and one showed no increase. This variability in Growth Hormone release is somewhat reminiscent of the situation of nonresponders to creatine. In fact, the authors of the study postulated that such differences in Growth Hormone release might underlie creatine-nonresponsiveness.
Finally, the amount of creatine used in the study was comparable to a typical loading dose - taken all at once! This practice is not recommended to the general product.
Unanswered Questions
1. Are other anabolic hormones similarly influenced by creatine?
In this study it was not determined whether other anabolic hormones, such as testosterone or insulin, similarly increase with creatine use.
2. What about Insulin-Like Growth Factor?
Many of the effects of Growth Hormone are mediated by Insulin-Like Growth Factor 1 (IGF-1), which the liver produces when stimulated by Growth Hormone. Interestingly, IGF-1 has also been shown to enhance creatine uptake into isolated muscle cells. Could this work in a feed-forward manner? In other words, does IGF-1-induced creatine uptake, further enhance Growth Hormone release.
3. What is the cellular signal that triggers Growth Hormone release?
Growth Hormone levels increase a few hours after creatine levels do. The biologically active form of creatine is phosphocreatine, creatine to which a phosphate group has been attached. Could phosphocreatine be the signal that triggers the release of creatine from the Anterior Pituitary in our brains?
Take Home
Creatine enhances exercise performance in most young and healthy individuals. Since exercise induces the release of anabolic hormones, creatine supplementation should also, in theory, indirectly increase the release of Testosterone, Insulin and Growth Hormone during exercise. This study suggests that creatine by itself (in the absence of exercise) may suffice to trigger the release Growth Hormone by the body. This finding is intriguing and might explain the previously unexplained increase in protein synthesis in isolated muscle cells not undergoing activity. Furthermore, if Growth Hormone mediates part of the effect of creatine supplementation, then this study might also explain why creatine supplementation is often less efficacious in the elderly, which have reduced Growth Hormone levels. In conclusion, this study suggests that creatine supplementation may have anabolic properties independent of its effect on energy metabolism. Future scientific investigation will tell if this finding is valid _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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LONG TERM... IS CREATINE SAFE??
Title: Effects of Long-term Creatine Supplementation on Liver and Kidney Functions in American College Football Players.
Researchers: Mayhew DL, Mayhew JL, Ware JS
Institution: Exercise Science Program at Truman State University, Kirksville, MO 63501 and the Athletic Department at Truman State University, Kirksville, MO.
Summary: The purpose of this study was to determine the effect of long-term Cr supplementation on blood parameters reflecting liver and kidney function.
Methods: Twenty-three members of an NCAA Division II American football team (ages = 19-24 years) with at least 2 years of strength training experience were divided into a Cr monohydrate group (CrM, n = 10) in which they voluntarily and spontaneously ingested creatine, and a control group (n = 13) in which they took no supplements. Individuals in the CrM group averaged regular daily consumption of 5 to 20g for 0.25 to 5.6 years. Venous blood analysis for serum albumin, alkaline phosphatase, alanine aminotransferase, aspartate aminotransferase, bilirubin, urea, and creatinine produced no significant differences between groups.
Results: Creatinine clearance was estimated from serum creatinine and was not significantly different between groups. Within the CrM group, correlations between all blood parameters and either daily dosage or duration of supplementation were nonsignificant.
Conclusion: Oral supplementation with CrM has no long-term detrimental effects on kidney or liver functions in highly trained college athletes in the absence of other nutritional supplements.
Discussion: Questions about creatine's safety are probably the most frequently brought up by people who don't like (and usually don't understand) supplements. This study by Mayhew and colleagues is a welcome addition to the already growing body of creatine safety research. (1,2,3,4,5,6,7)
Most questions revolve around the effects of creatine supplementation on the liver and kidney. These are the two organs are involved in "processing" creatine once it is ingested. The Liver breaks it down and the kidneys excrete it. >From this study, and others before it, we see that long term supplementation with creatine in doses usually taken by bodybuilders (5-20 grams) for extended periods of time do not lead to dysfunction of either organ, nor does it cause abnormalities in the indicators of liver and kidney function.
Considering that fact that creatine supplementation has been shown to enhance anaerobic exercise performance by increasing power output ( , muscular strength and work (9,10,11), and muscle fiber size (12), and to top it off, completely safe even with long term supplementation, its no wonder this is one of my first tier recommendation for effective and safe supplements for putting on muscle size.
Additional References:
1: Poortmans JR, Auquier H, Renaut V, Durussel A, Saugy M, Brisson GR. Effect of short-term creatine supplementation on renal responses in men. Eur J Appl Physiol Occup Physiol. 1997;76(6):566-7.
2: Poortmans JR, Francaux M. Long-term oral creatine supplementation does not impair renal function in healthy athletes. Med Sci Sports Exerc. 1999 Aug;31( :1108-10.
3: Terjung RL, Clarkson P, Eichner ER, Greenhaff PL, Hespel PJ, Israel RG, Kraemer WJ, Meyer RA, Spriet LL, Tarnopolsky MA, Wagenmakers AJ, Williams MH. American College of Sports Medicine roundtable. The physiological and health effects of oral creatine supplementation. Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2000 Mar;32(3):706-17.
4: Robinson TM, Sewell DA, Casey A, Steenge G, Greenhaff PL. Dietary creatine supplementation does not affect some haematological indices, or indices of muscle damage and hepatic and renal function. Br J Sports Med. 2000 Aug;34(4):284-8.
5: Poortmans JR, Francaux M. Adverse effects of creatine supplementation: fact or fiction? Sports Med. 2000 Sep;30(3):155-70.
6: Schilling BK, Stone MH, Utter A, Kearney JT, Johnson M, Coglianese R, Smith L, O'Bryant HS, Fry AC, Starks M, Keith R, Stone ME. Creatine supplementation and health variables: a retrospective study. Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2001 Feb;33(2):183-8.
7: Benzi G, Ceci A. Creatine as nutritional supplementation and medicinal product. J Sports Med Phys Fitness. 2001 Mar;41(1):1-10.
8: Earnest CP, Snell PG, Rodriguez R, Almada AL and Mitchell TL (1995) The effect of creatine monohydrate ingestion on anaerobic power indices, muscular strength and body composition. Acta Physiol Scand 153: 207-209
9: Casey A, Constantin-Teodosiu D, Howell S, Hultman E and Greenhaff PL (1996) Creatine ingestion favorably affects performance and muscle metabolism during maximal exercise in humans. Am J Physiol 271: E31-E37
10: Vandenberghe K, Goris M, Van Hecke P, Van Leemputte M, Vangerven L and Hespel P (1997) Long-term creatine intake is beneficial to muscle performance during resistance training. J Appl Physiol 83: 2055-2063
11: Volek JS, Duncan ND, Mazzetti SA, Staron RS, Putukian M, Gomez AL, Pearson DR, Fink WJ and Kraemer WJ (1999) Performance and muscle fiber adaptations to creatine supplementation and heavy resistance training. Med Sci Sports Exerc 31: 1147-1156
12: Volek JS, Duncan ND, Mazzetti SA, Staron RS, Putukian M, Gomez AL, Pearson DR, Fink WJ and Kraemer WJ (1999) Performance and muscle fiber adaptations to creatine supplementation and heavy resistance training. Med Sci Sports Exerc 31: 1147-1156 _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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Effects of creatine on Lipolysis
J Appl Physiol 2002 Aug 16; [epub ahead of print]
Creatine supplementation influences substrate utilization at rest.
Huso ME, Hampl JS, Johnston CS, Swan PD.
Department of Nutrition, Arizona State University, Mesa, AZ, USA.
The influence of creatine supplementation on substrate utilization during rest was investigated using a double-blind crossover design. Ten active men participated in 12 weeks of weight training and were given creatine and placebo (20 g/d for 4 d, then 2 g/d for 17 d) in two trials separated by a 4-week washout. Body composition, substrate utilization, and strength were assessed following week 2, 5, 9 and 12. Maximal isometric contraction (1-RM) leg press increased significantly (P < 0.05) following both treatments but 1-RM bench press was increased (33 kg +/- 8, P < 0.05) only following creatine. Total body mass increased (1.6 kg +/- 0.5, P < 0.05) after creatine but not after placebo. Significant (P < 0.05) increases in fat-free mass were found following both creatine (1.9 kg +/- 0. and placebo (2.2 kg +/- 0.7) supplementation. Fat mass did not change significantly with creatine, but decreased after the placebo trial (-2.4 kg +/- 0.8, P < 0.05). Carbohydrate oxidation was increased by creatine (8.9% +/- 4.0, P < 0.05), while there was a trend for increased RER after creatine supplementation (0.03 +/- 0.01, P = 0.07). Changes in substrate oxidation may influence the inhibition of fat mass loss associated with creatine following weight training.
Note: RER, or Respiratory Exchange Ratio, is a measure of how much fat vs. how much glucose is being used for fuel. The higher the RER, the more glucose/less fat there is being burned. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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Creatine and Alcohol
II. CREATINE AND ALCOHOL MIX
Background
Although no published studies have specifically examined the effects of alcohol on the effectiveness of creatine, alcohol does have known effects on muscle metabolism and survival. These indirect consequences of alcohol might, in turn, influence how well we respond to creatine supplementation.
Fast Twitch Muscle Fibers: Anaerobic
Not all muscles are the same. Muscle fibers can be loosely distinguished on whether they mediate fast or slow movements. Fast muscle fibers, also known as Anaerobic, do not require oxygen to work. Thusly, anaerobic muscle fibers are fast, since they are not limited by oxygen availability. On the other hand, they tire rapidly. Therefore, fast muscle fibers are fast to respond and fast to fatigue.
Fast (Anaerobic) muscle fibers are called into play when we undertake explosive movements. Lifting heavy weights and sprinting are examples of exercises recruiting fast muscle fibers. Did you know that professional sprinters often run the 100-meter race on a single breath? This is because breathing isn't mandatory while using anaerobic muscle fibers! However, because anaerobic fibers also fatigue rapidly, these activities can only be maintained briefly, approximately 10 seconds. In order to recuperate, however, fast muscle fibers do require oxygen. This is why we breathe harder following all out sprints.
Slow Twitch Muscle Fibers: Aerobic
Slow muscle fibers, on the other hand, are Aerobic. Aerobic simply means that slow muscle fibers require oxygen to generate force. As a consequence of their oxygen-dependency, these muscle fibers generate force more slowly. In other words, oxygen availability limits how rapidly slow muscle fibers respond. Therefore, slow muscle fibers provide lower forces, but last much longer. Activities calling into play slow muscle fibers require oxygen, i.e. breathing. Marathon runners rely heavily on slow muscle fibers. Obviously, you wouldn't want to run a marathon while holding your breath.
To summarize, the reason we can only sprint briefly, while we can walk for hours, is that these activities call into action different types of muscle fibers. Sprinting calls into play fast (anaerobic) muscle fibers. Fast muscle fibers generate brief, explosive forces. On the other hand, slow (aerobic) muscle fibers are used for movements lasting more than a few seconds. The amount of force generated by slow muscle fiber is much less and can only be maintained for as long as our breathing allows.
Creatine & Fast Muscle Fibers
Just as not all muscles are the same, creatine doesn't influence all muscle types in the same manner. Creatine preferentially increases the work output of fast muscle fibers. Recall that fast muscle fiber do not require oxygen to generate force. Because of creatine's preference for fast muscle we would notice an increase in sprint performance, while our jogging performance would go mostly unchanged. In other words, we are actually feeding fast muscle fibers by supplementing with creatine!
Protein Synthesis & Muscle Growth
It is natural that some muscle damage occurs during exercise. In fact, this exercise-induced muscle damage is essential for subsequent muscle growth. Simply speaking, we literally breakdown our muscles during exercise and rebuild them during recovery. Whether our muscle mass increases depends on which of these two processes predominates. For example, if muscle breakdown exceeds muscle regrowth, then we lose muscle mass. Protein synthesis, or the production of new muscle proteins, is an essential part of this rebuilding process following exercise.
Alcohol & Muscle Growth
Importantly for today's discussion, it appears that short-term alcohol use inhibits muscular protein synthesis. In fact, this effect is particularly pronounced in fast muscle fibers, especially after prolonged alcohol use. The scenario would be detrimental for any athlete trying to gain muscle mass and strength through training. After all, isn't the goal of training to increase muscle protein synthesis?
The problem is that creatine allows us to work harder, which is generally a good thing. However, this would also mean that muscle recovery is more critical while supplementing with creatine. Now, as alcohol consumption inhibits protein synthesis, a potentially fruitless situation may arise by mixing the two. That is, creatine and alcohol.
Finally, there is also some indication that creatine also stimulates protein synthesis. This effect may underlie part of creatine's benefit. If this is so, then alcohol consumption would offset this benefit of creatine as well.
Note: Keep in mind these important points:
Alcohol inhibits protein synthesis in fast muscle fibers.
Protein synthesis is essential for muscle growth and development.
Protein synthesis is important for muscle recovery.
Creatine increases the work output of fast muscle fibers.
Thus, fast muscle recovery is more critical during supplementation.
Creatine may increase protein synthesis as part of its benefit.
Alcohol may be particularly damaging during creatine supplementation _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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CAN CREATINE REDUCE MUSCLE DAMAGE?
Background
Muscle damage is a natural consequence of exercise. A small amount of muscle damage is not a terrible thing. In fact, small amounts of muscle damage actually stimulate new muscle growth, which is good. However, if the extent of muscle damage exceeds our body’s capacity to repair it and rebuild, we’re in big trouble. We then have a scenario of net muscle breakdown, otherwise known as catabolism, which defeats the whole point of working out and is a huge waste of time, money and effort.
Two principal forms of muscle damage arise from physical exertion. The first is mechanical and occurs immediately. In other words, our muscles tear slightly during the physical stress of exercise. The second form of muscle damage is the result of chemicals that are released during exercise and that exert their degenerative effects a few days later.
Free Radicals
Now, for more details on the second type of muscle damage. Intense exercise produces what are known as Reactive Oxygen Species, or ROSs for short. One of the most dangerous of the ROSs is the Superoxide Radical. Even sounds dangerous! Our body normally has the capacity to neutralize Superoxide as soon as it is produced.
How is Superoxide Produced?
Superoxide is produced from oxygen. Heavy breathing during intense exercise increases the rate of Superoxide production and surpasses the body’s capacity to neutralize it. This gives rise to a situation known as oxidative stress.
Superoxide weakens the muscle membrane causing it to tear. These small tears allow muscle’s contents to leak out and calcium ions to seep in. Importantly, an unregulated increase in intramuscular calcium activates enzymes that cause the muscle cell to self-destruct. Obviously, something we want to avoid.
Antioxidants
Our bodies contain a line of defense against oxidative stress; special molecules known as antioxidants that neutralize ROSs. Vitamins A, C and E are examples of vitamin antioxidants. Vitamin E is a particularly potent antioxidant that protects our cellular membranes from degradation following oxidative stress. Some studies suggest that the vitamin antioxidants can reduce exercise-induced muscle damage. Our bodies also come equipped with their own antioxidant molecules. Some of the most important are Superoxide Dismutase, Glutathione Peroxidase and Catalase.
Eating foods rich in antioxidants and getting plenty of rest increases our body’s capacity to deal with oxidative stress.
Is Creatine an Antioxidant?
Very recently (January 2002) a study was released suggesting that creatine might act as a Superoxide scavenger in its own right. It is therefore possible that part of the benefit we obtain from creatine derives from its capacity to act as an antioxidant.
The salient points of the study are as follows:
1. The concentration of creatine used in this study was within physiological limits. In other words, comparable to that found within skeletal muscle (20-60 mM, for those who are interested). This gave relevancy to the study.
2. Creatine is a mild antioxidant. Creatine was not as effective as Glutathione at scavenging free radicals
3. Creatine’s ability to neutralize Superoxide was measured in a test tube, not an exercising person.
Take Home
This preliminary report seems to suggest that creatine possess' antioxidant properties and can effectively neutralize Superoxide, one of the more insidious free radicals produced by exercise. However, since these findings where obtained in a test tube, it remains to be shown if creatine has the same effect in an exercising person. Although preliminary, this result is surely provocative and worth pursuing.
Scientific Reference
Lawler JM, Barnes WS, Wu G, Song W, Demaree S. (January 2002) Direct antioxidant properties of creatine. Biochemical and Biophysical Research Communications. 290: 1: pages 47-52. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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Another Creatine and Fat Loss
Background
Obviously, creatine finds its way into skeletal muscle after being ingested. But, how is this process actually accomplished?
From the blood stream creatine is transported into skeletal muscle via the action of transporter molecules distributed along the muscle surface. These are the molecular doors that allow creatine into muscle cells. Our physiological status determines how well these molecular doors work at letting in creatine. For example, the amount of sodium outside the muscle cell, the extramuscular sodium, regulates the activity of these transporter molecules. In this respect, an elevation of extramuscular sodium promotes creatine entry via these transporters.
Based on earlier studies showing that caffeine increases extramuscular sodium, it was proposed that caffeine should augment creatine transport into muscle cells and accentuate the benefits of creatine. Oddly, however, caffeine has the opposite effect than initially expected. Caffeine actually interferes with the enhancement of physical performance afforded by creatine. A possible explanation for this paradoxical finding is the topic of this month's newsletter.
The Study
A recent study specifically looked at the consequences of caffeine consumption on the physical benefit normally afforded by creatine supplementation. The study consisted of a cross over design, which simply means that the subjects were divided into either experimental (caffeine and creatine) or control (creatine alone) groups, tested after a week, switched of conditions and then retested.
Nine males participated in the study. Their ages ranged between 20 and 23 years. Initially both groups were given 0.5 grams of creatine/kilogram of body weight for six days. This amount is slightly greater than the typically prescribed loading dose. In addition, the experimental group was also given 0.005 grams of caffeine per kilogram of body weight on days 4, 5 and 6. Therefore, for the last three days of supplementation the experimental group consumed both creatine and caffeine. On the seventh day their physical performance was tested using knee extension torque measurements. This is one entire day after the last dose caffeine.
After a washout period of 3 weeks the groups were switched, such that the experimentals (caffeine and creatine) became controls (creatine alone) and visa versa. The experiment was repeated. In this respect the effect of caffeine could be compared within each individual.
The Result
Caffeine consumption negated the physical benefit observed in the creatine group. Surprisingly, the effect of caffeine was observed one entire day after the last dose. This finding was at first paradoxical, because caffeine, at least initially, was proposed to increased creatine absorption into skeletal muscle via its effect on extramuscular sodium.
The amount of caffeine used in this study is equivalent to 2-3 strong cups of coffee for an average sized male, or 350 mg of caffeine for a 70 kilogram (154 pound) male. One important detail might be that caffeine was administered in the form of capsules.
Interestingly, caffeine did not interfere with the rise in muscular phosphocreatine associated with creatine loading. Remember that phosphocreatine is the biologically active form of creatine found within cells. In other words, caffeine neither decreased (nor increased, as expected) creatine transport at the muscle surface. Its inhibitory effect was felt after creatine had entered and formed phophocreatine.
A Possible Resolution
Coordinated movement is the result of opposing muscle groups contracting and relaxing in unison. For example, when performing a curl our biceps (front of arm) contract into a ball, whereas our triceps (back of arm) relax and lengthen. On the downward movement, the triceps contract and the biceps relax.
Another example is sprinting. A sprinter initiates a stride by contracting the front muscles and relaxing the back muscles of one leg. To move forward, however, he must then quickly relax the front muscles and contract the back muscles of that leg, so that his other leg can shoot forward. Therefore, muscle relaxation is part of coordinated movement and thus speed.
Calcium is what causes muscles to either contract or relax. A muscle contracts when calcium is released from storage sites deep inside the muscle. In other words, free calcium is the signal that tells a muscle to contract. Likewise, our muscles relax when calcium is reabsorbed into these internal storage sites. However, the restorage of calcium is an energetically expensive process and in this manner muscle relaxation cost us energy. The energy that pays for muscle relaxation comes from phosphocreatine!
Dr. Hepel's group in Belgium has elegantly shown that phosphocreatine levels determine muscle relaxation rate. When our muscle phosphocreatine levels are high, as a result of supplementation, our muscles relax more rapidly. Conversely, when our phosphocreatine stores are low, muscle relaxation is slowed and our exercise performance drops.
Although caffeine doesn't alter phosphocreatine levels, caffeine may nevertheless retard muscle relaxation by altering muscle calcium levels. Interestingly, caffeine is known to release calcium form internal stores. As outlined previously, this would slow muscle relaxation and jeopardize exercise performance, despite caffeine's know stimulatory properties. Therefore, caffeine may negate creatine's benefit by liberating internal calcium and thereby slowing muscle relaxation time.
False Rumors
Caffeine is a diuretic, meaning that it increases the excretion of water from the body in the urine. There are rumors that caffeine counteracts creatine by interfering with muscle volumizing. This is simply a false rumor and assumes that water retention by skeletal muscle is the source of strength. Although increasing the girth (volume) of our muscles, volumizing per se has no proven effect on strength. This was the topic of a recent newsletter. View it here.
Take Home
If you pump up on caffeine prior to working out, while at the same time supplementing with creatine monohydrate to increase exercise performance, you could be wasting your time and money. Avoid this practice!
However, it must be mentioned that not all studies demonstrate an inhibitory effect of caffeine on the benefits afforded by creatine and may be a result of how creatine was administered, ie whether in liquid or tablet form.
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IV. CREATINE AND FAT
Background
It is common knowledge that creatine causes weight gain. The reason for this gain in weight seems to involve several distinct processes. Early phases of body mass increase involve the retention of water into skeletal muscle. Later phase of mass increase may involve the accretion of new muscle proteins.
Early Stages of Muscle Growth: Water Weight
Creatine monohydrate causes water to be retained in the body compartments where it is located. For this reason our muscles swell (with water) following creatine use. This process has been termed muscle "volumizing" in the scientific literature. This is a relatively fast process and can account for as much as 1-3 kilograms (~2-7 pounds) of added water weight after just a few days of loading. This increase in weight is much too fast to be attributed to the addition of new muscle proteins. Finally, since the faster we pack in creatine, the faster we'll gain water weight, muscle volumizing will be most pronounced during the loading phase.
After about a month of stopping creatine our muscle creatine stores return to normal and so should our body weight. In other words, we'll lose muscle water as our creatine levels return to their previously low values.
We'll also notice a drop in our energy levels. This is because creatine enhances our physical performance by increasing the amount of energy available _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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[last post continued]
We'll also notice a drop in our energy levels. This is because creatine enhances our physical performance by increasing the amount of energy available to our muscles.
Later Stages of Muscle Growth: New Protein Production
There is some indication that the acquisition of new muscle proteins also increases following creatine supplementation. This effect might be related to the greater work capacity afforded by creatine. In other words, we'll build more muscle since we'll be able to train harder.
Alternatively, muscle volumizing itself might stimulate the production of new muscle proteins. In this instance muscle swelling might falsely signal to the cell that it is growing. The muscle cell might then respond by increasing the production of new muscle proteins. The likelihood of this later possibility is currently being debated in the scientific press.
Any increase in muscle proteins as a result of prolonged creatine use should persist after stopping supplementation. These gains, however, will be relatively small in comparison to the initial rise in body weight attributed to water retention.
Lean Muscle Mass
The combined effects of increased muscle hydration and stimulated protein synthesis will increase our amount of lean muscle. In other words, the amount of protein and water contained within our muscles will increase relative to fat. You might have heard this fact being boosted in the popular press.
Fat is Fat and Muscle is Muscle and Never the Twain Shall Meet
It has often been rumored that a person's muscle turns to fat after stopping creatine. There is no more truth in this happening than there is in an apple turning into a banana? They are simply two different entities. Nevertheless, muscle can be replaced by fat given the wrong set of circumstances.
As mentioned above, after stopping creatine you'll lose some size due to loss of muscle water. You'll also experience a drop in energy level because of the slow degradation of surplus creatine stored within our muscles; remember that creatine is an energy source.
There's only one way you'll gain fat. That is if you reduce your energy expenditure dramatically, or stop working our altogether, while not adjusting your caloric intake. Under these circumstances the excess amounts of calories (food) you consume will be stored as fat.
Take Home
You will lose some size and strength after stopping creatine. This is unavoidable. The lost size, however, results from loss of water and not muscle tissue. The decrease in energy results from less creatine in our muscles. The only way that you will gain fat is if you consume more calories than you burn after stopping creatine.
Therefore, after stopping creatine for a prolonged period, be sure to maintain your exercise intensity, or alternatively, reduce caloric intake. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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Creatine and Injury Recovery
Background
Mature skeletal muscle is produced from the union of progenitor cells known as myoblasts. These myoblasts lie dormant waiting for the appropriate environmental cue to stimulate them to fuse. One of the most potent of such environmental cues is the loss of muscle tissue arising from inactivity or disease. To summarize, lost or damaged muscle is replaced by new muscle formed from the fusion of thousands of myoblasts.
The loss of muscle tissue because of inactivity or disease is known clinically as disuse atrophy. Anyone who has had a broken limb can testify to this effect. After weeks in a cast the immobilized limb is noticeably smaller and weaker than its unrestrained counterpart. In this instance inactivity resulted in muscle tissue actually being reabsorbed by the body. When the limb again becomes active the body replaces this lost muscle tissue through a process known as myogenesis.
Myogenic factors
Although muscle loss induces the process of regeneration, the actual triggering signal is a biochemical messenger. These biochemical messengers, also known as myogenic factors, were the focus of a recent study involving creatine.
The Study
This study examined the effect of creatine supplementation on the recuperation of muscle function following leg immobilization. Twenty-two college-aged subjects participated in the study. All subjects had their right leg immobilized in a cast for a period of two weeks. Ten weeks of rehabilitation therapy followed the two weeks of cast immobilization.
Throughout the entire study half of the subjects took creatine while the other half took placebo (maltodextrin). During the two weeks of immobilization the subjects supplemented their daily diets with 20 grams of either creatine monohydrate or placebo. During the rehabilitation period the creatine/placebo dose was reduced. For the initial three weeks of rehabilitation the subjects consumed 15 grams of creatine/placebo per day. Thereafter, the creatine dose was reduced to only 5 grams of creatine/placebo for the remaining seven weeks of rehabilitation.
Cross-sectional area of the quadriceps muscle (upper leg), leg extension power and myogenic factor expression were compared in the two groups.
Results
This study demonstrated that leg cross-sectional area and strength recovered more rapidly in those individuals who had supplemented with creatine.
Most importantly, myogenic factor expression was greater for the creatine group during the rehabilitation phase of the study. In particular, one myogenic factor, MRF4 (Myogenic Regulatory Factor 4), correlated strongly with the increase in leg cross-sectional area. It would thus appear that MRF4 is responsible for the muscle regeneration observed in this study. Interestingly, MRF4 exerts its greatest effect over those muscle fibers most sensitive to creatine supplementation; the fast muscle fibers.
Conclusions
This study concluded that creatine supplementation stimulates muscle growth and recovery through the production of myogenic factors, in particular one known as MRF4. The authors of the study openly state that "creatine supplementation is capable of shortening the duration of rehabilitation needed to restore muscle mass following an episode of disuse atrophy".
Take Home
This study suggests that creatine increases the expression of myogenic factors that induce muscles growth. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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Aubs Motorboat Queen

Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 9167
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:12 pm Post subject: |
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| did you post enuff articles? lol |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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There ya go... that's it for now. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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Mister C Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 20 Jan 2003 Posts: 3296 City: Burbank, SO-CAL
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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Holy crap. Now i see it. Thats gonna take a while to read. If i decide to read it. _________________ "I knew those girls were pros, but don't tell Turtle, it'll break his heart." - Drama, Entourage |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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Well... I'm done for the night. All that typing just flat wore me out!! lol... not really... thank god for copy & paste!! That should hold everyone over for the night. I'm tired and feel like absolute $#!t... g'night ya'll!! _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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Mister C Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 20 Jan 2003 Posts: 3296 City: Burbank, SO-CAL
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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Oh yeah, why did u go to church on a wednesday? _________________ "I knew those girls were pros, but don't tell Turtle, it'll break his heart." - Drama, Entourage |
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BR_WB Wakeboarder.com Freak

Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 2850
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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DaveBrowning,
So are you using creatine hahaha, I got lost.
Mr. C,
It's better to be safe than sorry, I just made sure I know my stuff before I started to put something into my body.
Later,
Brad |
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Mister C Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 20 Jan 2003 Posts: 3296 City: Burbank, SO-CAL
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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I dont plan on using creatine at any time in the near future, but if i do ill just refer back to this post and ill know more than enough to understand what the hell it is that im putting into my body. _________________ "I knew those girls were pros, but don't tell Turtle, it'll break his heart." - Drama, Entourage |
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ModelAMan Newbie

Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 48
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Posted: Apr 23, 2003 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr. C wrote: | | I dont plan on using creatine at any time in the near future, but if i do ill just refer back to this post and ill know more than enough to understand what the hell it is that im putting into my body. |
The info above is pretty consistant with what a lot of people say, but do you know that? Never take someone's word as gospel, especially over the internet. If you go into a supplement store you should know what you want before you get in there, otherwise they are going to take you for a ride.
I've worked at a supplement store and have done a lot of reading, plus talking to a lot of people, so I have my own views on things with my own biases.
Do you own reading and formulate your own opinions of things. I'm not saying you're stupid, that's far from my intention here, I just always question authority.  |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 24, 2003 4:15 am Post subject: |
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ModelAMan - These are studies bud... not opinions or just my word. That's why the references are there.
Brad - Yes, I'm taking ProLab Creapure Creatine.
Mr. C - You do know that there is wednesday night church don't you? _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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Mister C Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 20 Jan 2003 Posts: 3296 City: Burbank, SO-CAL
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Posted: Apr 24, 2003 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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I know they have church everyday at my parish, but I was just wondering if it was something special or you just had some urge to go. _________________ "I knew those girls were pros, but don't tell Turtle, it'll break his heart." - Drama, Entourage |
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Mariognarly Addict

Joined: 14 Jan 2003 Posts: 853
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Posted: Apr 25, 2003 1:34 am Post subject: |
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| Wow thanks Dave...thats quite a mouthful. But you can never go wrong with education. |
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ModelAMan Newbie

Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 48
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Posted: Apr 25, 2003 8:50 am Post subject: |
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| DaveBrowning wrote: | ModelAMan - These are studies bud... not opinions or just my word. That's why the references are there.
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There are many studies done with biases. If you've taken any psychology or statistics courses you'll find that many results are skewed. There are creatine studies that show detrimental affects but they can't link it to creatine. The breakdown of creatinine by the liver creates a byproduct and also makes the kidneys work harder. I take a protein supplement myself so overworking the kidneys is a concern of myself as well.
I don't really think creatine is bad, I just wouldn't take it for many years, I don't plan on ever using it either. |
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Dragonlady8 Guest
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Posted: Apr 27, 2003 3:56 am Post subject: |
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Just read the take home message at the end of each article. Interesting that some of these articles came from Flex magazine....definite bias reporting there.
After reviewing a few of the articles my take home message is this:
-basically works for people who are young and healthy who still have growth hormone production.
-all these studies are in theory and still need a lot of testing & research
- there's alot of money being spent for minimal gain that's ending up in the toilet.
Last edited by Dragonlady8 on Apr 27, 2003 8:05 am; edited 1 time in total |
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earlcombearl Wakeboarder.Commie

Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 2024 City: Omaha
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Posted: Apr 27, 2003 7:39 am Post subject: |
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I work out with my 12 ounce curles while watching fitness made simple. John Basedow is the man! _________________
| J-Ro wrote: | Maybe they will buy a huge mansion together.....install a public restroom stall in the living room.....and drill out a glory hole so all their friends can come over for a good time.  |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 28, 2003 11:25 am Post subject: |
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The people that would write these articles are doctor's who do studies and contribute to the magazine when they've done a study. It's not people that are bodybuilders that just write what they think. Creatine is not all that expensive either. Also, as far as gains go, the gains that are made are large gains, not minimal gains.
Nor-Cal - I've finished working out my new workout routine. I'm at school right now, but when I get home from work after school, I'll try and post it. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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Nor*Cal Ladies Man


Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 9479 City: Sac
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Posted: Apr 28, 2003 11:58 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Dave... I'm still working on mine. _________________ If I agreed with you we would both be wrong. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 28, 2003 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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Nor*Cal - Here's my workout routine...
Workout
-Monday (Chest)
-Flat Bench - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Incline DB Press - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Decline Press - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-DB Flyes - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Cable Crossovers - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Tuesday (Back)
-Pull-Up's - 5 sets (to failure)
-DB Row - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Back Pulldowns - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Seated Row - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Front Pulldowns - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Wednesday (Legs)
-Squats - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Extensions - 4 sets (10-12 1st 2 sets, 8-10 3rd set, 6-8 4th set)
-Leg Press - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Leg Curls - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Deadlifts - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Standing Calf Raises - 5 sets (20 first 3 sets, 15 last 2 sets)
-Seated Calf Raises - 4 sets (20 first 2 sets, 15 last 2 sets)
-Thursday (Shoulders)
-Shoulder Press - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-DB Press - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Side Raises - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Front Raises - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Upright Row - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Friday (Arms)
-Barbell Curl - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-DB Curl - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Preacher Curl - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Concentration Curl - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Skull Crushers - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Pushdowns - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Reverse Cable Ext. - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Barbell Reverse Curl - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Reverse Preacher - 4 sets (8-10 1st 2 sets, 6-8 3rd set, 4-6 4th set)
-Wrist Curl - 4 sets (10-12 1st 2 sets, 8-10 last 2 sets) _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 28, 2003 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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Well... I'm going to the gym. It's chest night... oh yay!! See ya'll at about 9:00 cst. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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Nor*Cal Ladies Man


Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 9479 City: Sac
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Posted: Apr 28, 2003 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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What days do you do cardio? What kind and how long? _________________ If I agreed with you we would both be wrong. |
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mobius Outlaw

Joined: 25 Feb 2003 Posts: 119 City: Hilliard
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Posted: Apr 29, 2003 8:57 am Post subject: |
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| Mariognarly wrote: | CREATINE IS HORRIBLE! Dont take that stuff man. I know it works, but its bad for your system. I would rather take herioin or something like that.  |
is heroin good for your system?  |
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BR_WB Wakeboarder.com Freak

Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 2850
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Posted: Apr 29, 2003 10:26 am Post subject: |
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Hey Dave,
Don't do deadlifts and squats on the same day...deadlifts are a back exercise. You're routine looks great though because it alternates a good bit. Cut back some though- that's a lot of exercises for each part. Also throw in millitary presses on your shoulder day.
Later,
Brad |
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DaveBrowning Wakeboarder.com Freak


Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Posts: 2666 City: The 'boro
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Posted: Apr 29, 2003 11:59 am Post subject: |
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Oops... didn't mean to put deadlifts. I'm not going to cut back any. Not one bit. Each muscle has specific exercises to help ME gain. It may be too much for you or some other person, but this workout is just right for me at this point. Also, Military Presses are just another name for Shoulder Presses. _________________ If my above post offends you in any way, simply ignore it. If you do not know how to ignore it, complain to me in a PM and I will show you how. |
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