Toni Smith's protest of the U.S. flag

jumalian · Ladies Man Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 7625 City: san diego

What do you guys think of Manhattanville College basketball player Toni Smith's protest of the flag, turning her back to it at basketball games? I don't care if you guys agree w/ her stance against war, rather her actions displaying her stance...at a basketball game.

I think it's total disrespect to the millions of people that gave her the freedom to express her opinion. Expressing her opinion isn't wrong, but the manner she expresses them, I think is total lack of respect.

wake152 · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 3:22 pm Post subject:

it is pathetic shes even getting htis much poblicity however u spell it

marcg · Addict Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 944 City: Salt Lake City

It is brilliant if you want publicity, everyone is just eating it she'll have her own
talk show in a few, just you watch.

derrick lenz · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 3:30 pm Post subject:

i think it's ironic that she's turning her back on the very thing that allows her to voice her opinion. i hate when people are so ignorant that they act like we have it bad in america. they're are numerous other ways that you can voice your opinion. you don't have to disrespect your country and all those who gave their lives so you could keep you freedom.

ohsix · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 3:30 pm Post subject:

this was discussed before in this thread:

http://forums.wakeboarder.com/viewtopic.php?t=2234

jumalian · Ladies Man Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 7625 City: san diego

Thank you Wes, but I'd like a poll to see what percentage agrees and/or disagrees w/ what she's doing.

Derrick, well said.

NAW · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 7:13 pm Post subject:

She needs to sit down and go through a photo album with a vietnam vet, or talk with a sufferer of Gulf War Syndrome, or an old man who stormed the beach at Normandy....Hopefully she would show a little more respect for the men who died for our freedoms, one freedom which she exercises when she turns her back to the flag, expression. IMO, her turning her back on the flag is not a protest of government policy, but a protest of all the flag stands for. It makes me wanna puke. That's all I have to say about that.

DaveBrowning · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 7:16 pm Post subject:

I totally agree with you naw. She's a freaking liberal idiot!

wake152 · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 7:18 pm Post subject:

anyone see the dude that ran on the basketball court with the american flag. he is the man. I saw it on sports center last week

DaveBrowning · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 7:19 pm Post subject:

I didn't see that... too bad I missed it. That woulda been awesome!! Smile

skobi1 · Addict Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 639 City: eugene, or

It's not worth my time or effort to even know her name Mad

nmballa · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 9:34 pm Post subject:

II think she exercised her freedom and I see nothing wrong with it. Just like Im exercising my free speech now and will probably catch alot of flak for it. But thats my opinion.

ohsix · Posted: Mar 02, 2003 9:36 pm Post subject:

her freedom is that she doesnt have to say the pledge not that she has to deliberately disrespect it. just like my freedom is to hate cops but i cant flip them off and talk sh*t to them.

Jello John · Wakeboarder.Commie Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 1936

Hmm...I feel dumb. I accidentally voted 'no' instead of 'yes'. I will never make fun of Florida voters again.

Joe - The majority of the members of this forum have conservative views. I doubt a poll was needed to find out what the results would've been.

I think she could've found a better way to protest, but I personally believe no one should be forced to do something they don't believe in. I don't know too much about this topic, but I do think her protesting is directed at our current administration and not at our former war veterans or at our country as a whole. Please correct me if I am wrong.

E.J. · Ladies Man Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 7597 City: Mogadishu

So let me get this correct.... If you want to voice your opinion in this Country, you can...unless it is not popular and then you are an idiot and shouldn't have the right to express an opinion.

Freedom of speech and expression unless it doesn't sit right with the general public....then stone the person....

Yes, millions of Americans have died making it possible for Miss Smith to express this view. Hopefully those who died had the presence of mind to know that they were dying for that exact thing, so she could do this.

Just an opinion....

E.J.

MadDog · Soul Rider Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 465 City: Upstate NY

Personally, I think what she did is rediculous, and disrespectful, but that it is her right to do. The fact that she has the right to turn her back on the flag is part of what makes this country great. If we as a society were to start to take away anyones freedom of expression we would all eventually suffer. So as much as her individual actions discust me, I am glad that we live in a society where she has the right to express her opinion.

NAW · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 9:31 am Post subject:

Yep, that's what I was trying to say Mad dog....

ohsix · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 10:23 am Post subject:

MadDog · Soul Rider Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 465 City: Upstate NY

But that is just it, She does have the right to disrespect the flag, Sh could burn a flag in protest in her front yard if she wanted (but agreed not at a basketball game). And although I think what she did is rediculous, it is her right to do.

MadDog · Soul Rider Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 465 City: Upstate NY

OK, I just re-read my last post and I think it came off a bit too harsh. All I am trying to say is while I like most on this forum disagree with her views, I am proud that we live in a society where she has the right to express that view without being persecuited.

E.J. · Ladies Man Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 7597 City: Mogadishu

Wes,

I truly hope you are not saying a persons choice to not face the flag while the national anthem is played, is on equal ground with someone going into a church with a burning cross. I wont even go into the flying airplanes into buildings.....

The woman is making a non-violent protest of something she feels strongly about. What exactly is the problem? Should everyone get in lock step with our elected officials and follow like sheep?

Next, I think that we should start putting snipers in the stands at baseball games and shoot these idiots who don't take off their hats during the national anthem. And speaking of non patriotic, what about these people who don't fly the flag on national holidays.....burn their houses..... Not to mention the people who leave their flag up all night, but it is not illuminated....what are they thinking.....take their firsts born.....

Note, I am not saying that I agree with Miss Smith's stance, but love that she is legally able to make it. Isn't it beautiful that the United States is so secure in our system, that we not only allow, but encourage the young and old alike to have and express an opinion.

E.J.

MadDog · Soul Rider Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 465 City: Upstate NY

Well, E.J. I guess my post doesn't seem harsh compared to yours, but I have to say that I agree with you.

ohsix · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 11:26 am Post subject:

MadDog · Soul Rider Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 465 City: Upstate NY

ohsix · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 12:36 pm Post subject:

wake152 · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 12:38 pm Post subject:

unfortunatly wes its part of freedom of speech. I really disagree with the girl and think she should be sent to iraq to live or to fight but i guess we cant do that. But shes just a dumb girl looking for attention.

ohsix · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 12:43 pm Post subject:

Our freedom of speech is limited and I believe this falls outside the limits. If that is protected by freedom of speech then why cant you say "i have a bomb" on an airplane without being subject to being searched and possibly arrested? All you did was exercise your freedom of speech. There are limits on our freedom of speech for a reason.

wake152 · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 12:46 pm Post subject:

ha ha man after 9-11 i would hope no one would even think of saying that. I think they are two totally diff things

DaveBrowning · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 12:52 pm Post subject:

She is protesting that we should not go to war right? Our flag represents America correct? If she turns her back on our flag, the she is turning her back on our nation. If she doesn't believe in what our nation is doing, why live in it? Back to my first question... what does TURNING HER BACK TO OUR NATIONS FLAG WHILE OUR NATIONAL ANTHEM IS BEING PLAYED have to do with us not going to war? Yeah sure... "I'm going to turn my back on our nations flag while our national anthem is being played." and that's going to keep us from going to war!!?? AND IF YOU SAY IT IS ABOUT HER FREEDOM AND HER RIGHT... IT'S NOT... REMEMBER... it's protesting that we should not go to war. Don't matter anyway... we're going to war... we're gonna kick "So-Damn-Insane's" @$$!!

MadDog · Soul Rider Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 465 City: Upstate NY

ohsix · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 12:55 pm Post subject:

OttoNP · Addict Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 848 City: MI

I think that what she did should not be illeagal; however, it is a poor way to express disagreement with the current administation's policies. I think that the fact that she protests this way negates her opinion, because it shows her lack of maturity and consideration. Additionally, if she thinks that her actions will have any affect on persuading others I hope she is mistaken. I view it as a immature act by someone too lazy to do something that may actually help express her view in a meaningful way, such as writing a congressmen, writing a well though out article with actual points, etc...

The way I see it, there's nothing wrong with disapproving with the current administrations policy's, protesting it, them, etc... You can be patriotic and disagree with current policies, but no matter what you have to support our country and our troops. Our troops aren't deciding to fight, they are following orders, they do not deserve anything but out best wishes, our thanks, and our respect. The stories I hear of what protestor's did to Vietnam veterans are horrible, protest those in charge of the decisions but honor those that are willing to die for everyone in the country, regardless of your view of the decision to put them there.

Nick
________
Juggalo

MadDog · Soul Rider Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 465 City: Upstate NY

And wes, saying you have a bomb on a plane endangers. The panic it would cause could injure someone. Turning your back to the flag does not cause physical harm. And announcing that you have a bomb is in no way expressing your opinion. It is just causing chaos. Two totally different scenarios

DaveBrowning · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 1:02 pm Post subject:

YES IT COULD!!! IT COULD MAKE PEOPLE EXTREMELY ANGRY!! She could get the $h!t beat out of her for what she did. Then that would make somebody on her side mad then it's a big chain of events... yes, maddog... it could cause physical harm.

ohsix · Posted: Mar 03, 2003 1:03 pm Post subject:

Very good points nick. I agree with all of what you said except the first 10 words, but it is all a matter of how her actions affected yourself personally. If enough people agree that what she did is bad enough i think it should be considered illegal.