Help settle an argument

[WakeTech]

I know the anser to this one already but a fellow co-worker thinks differently I just want to re-inforce my opinion.

When you eat shizzle and knock yourself out do you float or sink ?

I say instant floater for a while then a little sinkage ounce you fill up and are not rescued

[logan]

you would float, that is why you wear a life jacket, to float!

[WakeTech]

take into account non approved vests or no vest at all

[logan]

non approved you will float, no vest you will sink, when you account your thrust into the water and the fact you are conked out

[electricsnow]

Collin wright did a little test for alliance a couple of years ago that should answer your question. He took a brick and threw it into a local swiming pool so he could hold onto it under water. He would then exhale (since you aren't going to be able to hold your breath in if you're knocked out--you know, breathing's involuntary at that point), and without a vest, he stayed at the bottom.

With a non-coast guard approved vest...he either floated up a little bit, or he floated up to the surface very slowly (take into consideration that if you were riding in a body of water that had a current you might very well be in a rough situation). I can't remember anymore.

And lastly, with the coast guard approved vest he floated up to the surface.

[Swass]

"non approved you will float..."

Ignorance can be dangerous.

[Stephan]

The problem with the non-approved is what happens when you start filling up with water? I mean Colin's test is good & I've done a similar thing with my non approved vest. but imagine if your lungs are filling full of water as you slowly float to the surface, it will stop all floating progress and you wil sink like a ton of bricks, it's also dependant on if you stayed in the bindings or not. I remember Darin Shapiro talking about saving Tara Hamilton's ass, she was floating just underthe surface face down and the only thing that was keeping her up was her board/bindings.

[justin h.]

The Collin Wright article is one of the most irresponsible articles ever published. It is not accurrate and can be read as justification for not wearing a vest.

He tied several pounds of solid weights to a vest and it sank. No suprise. People are made mostly of water and are almost bouyant anyway. A vest, even a non-coastgaurd vest will float you on the surface. Not wearing a vest can kill you.

I have worked at ski-schools for several years and seen a handful of people knocked out. Without a vest they sink like a rock. With a vest they have always been right on the surface.

Not to be harsh, but I read that article a few years ago and it really troubled me.

[Wakebrad]

damn justin, don't get on this board much do yah?

But what if you were wearing board shorts over your wetsuit? That should give you more flotation

[wesgardner]

HeyWakeTech,

As you learn in diving, getting "neutrally bouyant" is somewhat different for each individual...some folks are "floaters" some are not...with lungs full of water, I think you're on your way down...


Wes

[electricsnow]

Justin, are you talking about some other test? He didnt' tie any weights to the vest, he actually wore the vest. The whole Idea was to promote wearing life vests...he wouldn't be convincing people otherwise after what happened to cordell. You must have misunderstood the article.

And you'll only float if you have air in your lungs, not because there's a lot of water in your body.

Stephan, in collin's article he mentioned something about how it might not have been likely for him to float to the surface with a non-cga vest because if he were truly knocked out, he wouldnt' be able to hold his breath (which makes your situation quite likely). Obviously that's not verbatim so you'd have to re-read the article to get his words. But it was a responsible article and it did promote the use of coast guard approved vests.

[Partyb]

I think another benefit of the CGA vest is that it will float you face up, or is supposed to. Is that right?

[Wakebrad]

no, it doesn't float you face up. Its just supposed to keep you afloat when your lungs are filled with water.

[MX21]

Both You will sink .... then float in about 3-5 days.....

[fuel]

Electricsnow is right on about that article. I remember reading that in one of my old Alliance mags. Basically, he put on a non-cga approved vest and held onto the brick and blew all of the air out of his lungs, then let go. He floated up to the surface, but very slowly. When he used his CGA vest doing the same test, he bobbed up like a cork.

Collin was basically saying that it is your choice, but he personally was going to wear CGA apporved vests only.

Check out some pics of Collin riding. Hell, I've seen him sporting some camo Stearns lifejackets and they are definitely CGA.

[Tyson]

Here's the real answer to the orginal question, taken from the US Coast Guard website.

http://www.uscg.mil/hq/gm/mse4/pfddefinition.htm

There are differing states of CGA (type I, II, & III), but I think (don't quote me) that without a wakeboard strapped to your feet the highest level of approval states that your head will be out of the water in case you are unconsious. If you've ever worn one of those nasty orange vests, they try and spin you over if you wear it correctly. It's pretty hard to stay on your chest. I've worn one goofing around wakeboarding one time, and when you fall, they are so bouyant they shoot you back up out of the water, it's almost painful sometimes.

Personal preference on what you use though.

Tyson

[Todd Armstrong]

Partyb that is exactly what they are to do

[Swass]

Educate yourself. PLEASE:

http://www.uscgboating.org/safety/fed_reqs/equ_pfd2.htm

BTW - we wear Type IIs.

[Todd Armstrong]

most people were type III

[Swass]

Ha! I forgot a "I." (I swear.) My point was (or was supposed to be) that the type of vest we wear does NOT flip us over to our back! EVER! If you're unconscious, that's the position you'll stay in 'til someone fishes your ass out.

For those of you wearing non-approved vests, try this: Expell as much air from your lungs as possible and see how well you float. (This, of course, does not mimic a lung-full of water and no voluntary movement.) How 'bout while wearing those blingy wakeskate shoes?

The sport is dangerous enough. I can't understand why some of us choose to make it more so.

[freerider4]

JUST REMEMBER ONCE YOU GET DOWN TO 30 FEET STRAIGHT FREE FALL FROM THERE SINCE YOU DON'T FLOAT PAST 30 FEET SO REMEMBER WHEN WAKEBOARDING WEAR A VEST AND WHEN SCUBA DIVING PUMP A BIT MORE AIR IN THE BC.

[x vegan x]

There are two major flaws most of you are overlooking. 1) Different body types have different buoyances. Darin Shapiro will go down like a rock since muscle is heavier than water, whereas a lazy fat person may very well float with no vest at all because fat floats. 2) Not all vests have the same buoyancy. I've worn non-approved vests that barely floated me even with air in my lungs, and I've worn others that were only marginally less buoyant than an approved vest.

[gvb]

study or no study... if I wasn't wearing a vest when I got my concussion (and an hours worth of memory loss) I would have been at the bottom of the river. I was face down in the water trying to swim down (because that is where I saw light, as it spun around me in circles for 30 seconds).

-gvb

[otiswunguy]

i would say it also depends on temp of water and the lake. a body of water with any salt in it would be easier to float in than a lake without.