Our winch build thread....

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 02, 2011 4:42 pm Post subject: Our winch build thread....

So looks like we're starting construction this week. I figured I'd go ahead and document it in a thread here...

I don't have much to show yet, but hope to in the next couple weeks.

So far, we've acquired some 2"x2"x3/16" square steel tubing for a frame base.

and we'll be using a donor 8hp Honda engine, rescued from a life of decay under this work bench. Laughing

That's pretty much it for now. Though we're still fine tuning the final layout, we're hoping to end up with something along the lines of this:

Stay tuned....

GnarShredd · Posted: Mar 03, 2011 6:11 am Post subject:

Awesome, good luck with the build. You'll be happy with an 8hp engine over the 6.5 a lot of people use. I've got an 8 on mine and it'll deep-water start all 215lbs of me.

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 03, 2011 7:53 am Post subject:

GnarShredd, good to know because its going to need to deep water start all 230 lbs of me! Laughing

GnarShredd · Posted: Mar 03, 2011 8:48 am Post subject:

HHI Dave, Shouldn't be a problem, especially on a wakeboard (you might need a little practice, but you should be able to get it). Mine can (usually) deep-start me even on a wakeskate without too much trouble.

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 03, 2011 9:25 am Post subject:

I figure that deep water starting me on a skate will be the ultimate test. Can't wait to get this thing going! Exclamation

supermanotorious · Soul Rider Joined: 10 May 2010 Posts: 345 City: Phoenix

congrats on starting the build, you'll find the frame easy with that saw, Gnar is right, deepwater start on wakeskate is all about technique, some days I got it, some days I don't

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 04, 2011 9:59 am Post subject:

Looks like we're going to go with 600' of line, at least initially, to cut costs.

Any opinions on this? Its the best price I've found so far....
http://www.boardstop.com/product_info.php?products_id=4690{15}64

GnarShredd · Posted: Mar 04, 2011 11:54 am Post subject:

I have to do some research but I know there's a marine store online that is really cheap for some great line but I can't remember how it was in comparison to that.

600' will be PLENTY, more than you think. I originally bought 1000' and sold 400 of it because I never used it. with 600' I've never had any problems, even on the beach.

supermanotorious · Soul Rider Joined: 10 May 2010 Posts: 345 City: Phoenix

Gnar is referring to:

http://www.seattlemarine.net/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=9374&idcategory=0

when you buy a spool of 600' it's only $84, or .14 per foot, same stuff boardstop is selling for alot less, that being said, I like the rope but many times we winch in areas where the rope is getting dragged around concrete and other surfaces tough on rope, so I get 600' spools of $20 harbor freight rope, they last about 18 months and are far cheaper to replace

http://www.harborfreight.com/600-ft-x-1-4-quarter-inch-polypropylene-rope-47836.html

I don't know where the hell they come up with 113 lb working load, my winch and that rope have deep water started a 300 lb dude many times

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 04, 2011 4:00 pm Post subject:

supermanotorious,

Wow, I like the $20 price but how is it to ride? Is there a lot of stretch? I'll admit, I've ridden boats and cables, even been dragged by an SUV, but this will be my first winch ride.

Even $84 is perfectly reasonable for 600 ft of non-stretch line at Harbor Freight.

By the way, got a lot done on the winch today. The frame is laid out. Got pics but unfortunately I have to go to dinner now. I'll post them as soon as I can. Cool

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 04, 2011 8:37 pm Post subject:

Ok, here are a few pics. Sorry for the crappy cell phone pics but I didn't have my camera with me. Crying or Very sad

Here's where the magic happens

Cutting lengths of steel for the frame

Frame base laid out

Test fitting the hitch receiver. Note the sweet custom mounted board rack in cased you missed it before...

Tacking on the uprights

Here's how we finished it for today. Note the gussets reinforcing the uprights.

Test fit on an old Chevy shortbed in the shop. CHEEZE! (NOTE: The front of the truck was up on a lift that's why the winch frame is not level.)

supermanotorious · Soul Rider Joined: 10 May 2010 Posts: 345 City: Phoenix

there is NO stretch to it, I have some of the pickiest riders and they say it's no different than any "pro" line they've ever winched with, that's the only 600' rope at HF, the amsteel is thru Seattle Marine

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 06, 2011 6:04 am Post subject:

Well we're headed to HF to pick up a few things today. We'll see if they have that line in stock. Cool

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 06, 2011 3:55 pm Post subject:

Ok, had a pretty productive day today. Got back from Harbor Freight and Lowes with quite a few goodies. We also stopped and picked up the motor along the way.

Honda 8hp with 600 ft of polypropylene line (what a bargain at $17.99!) Good news is, after replacing a missing part on the carburetor, the engine fired up on the 3rd pull!

We went ahead and welded a solid 5/8" axle to the bottom of the frame and installed the 10" tires from HF ($5.99 ea.)

For the spool, we canabalized an old airhose reel (like the one in the next picture) that was laying out back then utilized some 1/2" threaded studs and sleeves cut to length and fastened with stainless nuts and lock washers.

For the axle we used a 3/4" galvanized steel tube with galvanized floor flanges. Over all, its feels solid as a rock but its not super heavy either. We'll see how it works.

And just a teaser pic of what its eventually going to look like. The motor is just resting there and I'm holding the spool, but you get the idea...

Next we are going to work on getting the drivetrain set up. We'll be picking up some axle bearings (probably at Advance Auto) and a CC from a local small engine shop. Hope to have this thing up and riding very soon! Stay tuned!

NKCrider · Posted: Mar 06, 2011 6:12 pm Post subject:

screw the winch, whose lambo is that Shocked

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 06, 2011 9:12 pm Post subject:

supermanotorious · Soul Rider Joined: 10 May 2010 Posts: 345 City: Phoenix

hold off on the CC, I implore you to get a TAV (Bulletlines), you'll be happy you did, even if you get the CC you'll eventually get the TAV so save some money, you have some extra anyway from the savings on your line Very Happy

NKCrider · Posted: Mar 08, 2011 11:32 am Post subject:

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 08, 2011 12:29 pm Post subject:

supermanotorious, what are the pros and cons of the CC vs. the TAV? We're definitely trying to build this winch on a budget but obviously we still want it to perform. Fill me in.

NKCrider, my buddy Bev (pronounced BEEV) owns and operates Bluffton Automotive/Bev Tech Performance. We're building the winch at his shop. The Lambo belongs to one of his regular customers. Its a 2004 V10 AWD Gallardo. We actually drove it over to the warehouse the day we went to pick out the steel for the winch frame. Laughing

GnarShredd · Posted: Mar 08, 2011 2:34 pm Post subject:

HHI Dave, The TAV will be easier on the engine, allow for smoother starts, be easier on the driver and rider, and will help with deep-water starts.

supermanotorious · Soul Rider Joined: 10 May 2010 Posts: 345 City: Phoenix

Gnar is right, since the TAV is a variable transmission it will detect load and adjust gearing accordingly, this means for deepwater start it will provide more torque to pull the rider thru the water, as the rider planes and the load is less the TAV will gear for more speed, the CC simply allows the engine to idle without the winch spooling but you'll only get the speed and torque the engine offers

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 11, 2011 1:14 pm Post subject:

Ok guys, getting some work done on the winch today. Getting the bearings mounted for the spool and might get the fairlead mounts underway.

A couple of quick questions regarding the TAV. Our 8 HP Honda motor has a 1" shaft. Looking at the TAV's online I see two available to fit that shaft, one with 10 teeth, the other with 12 teeth. We assume that the 10 tooth will provide more OOMPH for takeoff on deepwater starts. Is this correct?

Secondly, what size sprocket (# of teeth) do you guys recommend for the spool? We have access to several sizes thanks to a bunch of spare go kart parts, but a recommended starting point would be a big help.

Thanks for all of the input so far. More pics to follow soon and hopefully some riding video in the next couple weeks.... Cool

GnarShredd · Posted: Mar 11, 2011 1:35 pm Post subject:

HHI Dave, You can go with either the 10 or the 12, the most important part is the ratio of the sprocket on the spool to the one on the TAV. You'll want to go for a 6 to 1 ratio (spool to TAV), that seems to be the magic number for almost everyone as a right mix of torque and speed. For example:

72 tooth on the spool if you have a 12 on the TAV
60 tooth on the spool if you have a 10 on the TAV

I would recommend getting one that fits a #40/41 chain vs a #35. You can get away with a #35 but I've seen more problems with those (broken chains, chains falling off, etc). I've NEVER had a problem with my #40, solid as a rock.

In addition to all of that, with a 6 to 1 ratio you'll need about a 7" inner diameter on the spool. I made an adjustable spool because depending on how the motor runs/your gearing, you may need to adjust that anywhere between 6" and 8" to get things dialed in right.

I forget which TAV I have on my winch right now, I'll have to check. But remember the 6 to 1 ratio and you're golden.

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 11, 2011 3:10 pm Post subject:

GnarShredd, thanks for the quick response. I guess we'll go with the 10 tooth TAV with the #40/41 chain.

Looks like we built our spool with about a 8.5" I.D. and we have a 64 tooth spool sprocket handy...any input on this?

Thanks again.

EDIT: Got the bearings mounted. We're pretty much at a stopping point until we get the TAV in.

GnarShredd · Posted: Mar 14, 2011 7:38 am Post subject:

Hmm, you may be ok with that setup. I'd worry about the inner diameter of the spool being a bit big and losing some torque because of it but having that 64-tooth instead of a 60-tooth sprocket might help a little (very little, but sometimes that's all it takes!). I would say do a few test-runs with everything as-is and if you're not getting enough torque to deep-water start/get up to speed, fiddle with things a little until it's right. I spent a couple days dialing my winch in once I put everything together the first time.

Once you get to the testing phase, adjusting the throttle/removing the governer on your motor can help a lot, you can work winch motors a little harder than you can in a go-kart or something since the pulls are so short and it's not too stressful for the motor.

Remember when fine-tuning, you're pretty much always going to be trading speed for torque, so you'll have to balance the two.

GnarShredd · Posted: Mar 14, 2011 7:39 am Post subject:

Oh, also, what about a fairlead, you can figure out a mount for one of those while you're waiting to get the TAV.

HHI Dave · Posted: Mar 14, 2011 12:46 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the input. We pretty much realized that there was going to be a good bit of fine tuning once it was built. Fortunately there's a pond very near the shop that we can use for R&D.

I've got a fairlead, hopefully the mounts will get fabbed up soon.

Dante2004 · Newbie Joined: 12 Apr 2011 Posts: 15 City: Houston

HHI Dave · Posted: Apr 16, 2011 7:47 am Post subject:

supermanotorious · Soul Rider Joined: 10 May 2010 Posts: 345 City: Phoenix

sweet, here's a tip for your chain, ACE hardware has connecting links including offset links the virtually remove the need for engine slide

HHI Dave · Posted: Apr 16, 2011 12:43 pm Post subject:

Thanks! This one came with a connecting link. Not sure about the offsets but we allowed ourselves some wiggle room as far as mounting the engine on the frame. Good tip though if we need it. Cool

supremelandingmaster · Newbie Joined: 18 Apr 2011 Posts: 10 City: Kingston

very nice

GnarShredd · Posted: Apr 19, 2011 5:07 am Post subject:

HHI Dave, Good luck! Driving with your winch in tow to the testing ground is one of the most exciting things ever.

cheesewizz · Outlaw Joined: 07 Jul 2003 Posts: 231

yup awsome job looks great cant wait to here the good news