the american dream

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

A recent poll showed that almost half of Americans no longer believe one can get ahead in the US through hard work.

It was an ABC/Yahoo Poll, for what that's worth.

Why do you think this is?

BrentC5Z · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 9:50 am Post subject:

On a side note, almost half of Americans believe in hard work.

eeven73 · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 9:51 am Post subject:

Well, how many people felt that way 5, 10 or 20 years ago?

Pull a statistic out or your ass and then expecting intelligent discussion. Rolling Eyes

Trolling

I do know this.

At least 50% of the population is retarded so I discount what they think or feel automatically.

Nor*Cal · Ladies Man Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 9479 City: Sac

Some of that 50% believes the Government will regulate their work, mandate their behavior and spending or tax their income to the point that everything is homogenized...

The other part believes they are being held down by corporate America and Wealthy white anglo saxons.

intotheflats · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 9:57 am Post subject:

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

fish6942 · Addict Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Posts: 603

Most people believe they have above average intelligence.

PKwakeboard · Outlaw Joined: 20 Mar 2009 Posts: 167 City: Dallas

I think that shows 50% of this country is lazy as stuff. They would rather sit around and let our government take care of them rather than doing it themselves.

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

Well, it didn't say that the people were not trying and working, just that they believed that hard work alone was not going to get them success.

Faust · Wakeboarder.Commie Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 1496

1 Please provide a link to the poll.

2 Define 'hard work'. Define 'get ahead' or 'success'

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

I have no link. I only heard it just now on NPR.

Take it for what it's worth.

here is articles http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/abc-newsyahoo-news-poll-people-are-losing-faith-in-the-american-dream

Nor*Cal · Ladies Man Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 9479 City: Sac

microman · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 10:22 am Post subject:

Was the so-called "American Dream" ever real anyway? It brings up the issue of social mobility and the wealth gap once again. Nonetheless, real wages have been declining for a long time now. It's reasonable for people to conclude that "hard work" doesn't always equal success. We are part of the first generation in some time that expects to be worse off than the one preceding it.

Nooga678 · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 10:46 am Post subject:

Who is John Galt?

microman · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 10:49 am Post subject:

Nor*Cal · Ladies Man Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 9479 City: Sac

jryoung · Ladies Man Joined: 19 Mar 2004 Posts: 7664 City: Man Jose

Damn regulations killed my edible lead idea, my dream is dead. Laughing

goofyboy · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 11:05 am Post subject:

I am upwardly mobile in wealth. I came out of college parking cars and bouncing. I got my first real job working for the Astros, selling season tickets making $7.50 an hour plus commission. From there i moved into other sales and now i am proud owner of a cubicle in a HUGE cube farm. I make really good money now and am on my path to pretty good wealth. I have worked my butt off to get where I am.

I am achieving the American dream. I am way ahead of where my parents were at my age. I am moving up in social / economic mobility. If I can do it, so can others. The dream is dead for anyone not willing to go out and hustle.

microman · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 11:14 am Post subject:

chavez · RIP MHL 04/25/1958 - 01/11/2006

Nor*Cal · Ladies Man Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 9479 City: Sac

Wakebrad · Ladies Man Joined: 11 Dec 2003 Posts: 12257 City: Dallas

A lot of people say and think that because they're too concerned that if it's true, that they are responsible for their lack of success. Of course it's someone else's fault that I'm not successful. It's much easier to think it's not possible to get ahead via hard work, than it is to try it for an extended period of time. Hard work for 2 weeks will get you nowhere. Hard work over time will almost always be rewarded.

There is another component too. You have to work smart. You have to look to where you want to go, develop a plan to achieve it, and work hard toward that plan. A solid plan may not even require that much hard work.

You can't be a lazy slacker at your job for 2 years, put 2 weeks of hard work in and then expect to get a promotion.

But basically, I agree. This country's F'ed. If people don't think hard work will get you anywhere they're not going to work hard. They are just going to rely on the government to provide for them and vote accordingly. Then there won't be any reward for hard work. Self-fulfilling prophesy.

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

I don't think so, wakebrad.

I think it tends to be the opposite, that people who worked hard and had sucess need to believe that all it takes is hard work. Otherwise, their success can be taken away and they are less in control of their own destinies.

I'm sure SOME people don't want to be responsible for their lack of success, but I think that some other people don't recognize circumstance and providence.

For instance, I work hard and have worked a lot of siht jobs to advance to better jobe. But last year I got laid off. I worked at the tattoo shop and went back to school. I finished the academic portion of my degree, and then I happened to get a call from someone I KNOW IN THE INDUSTRY who offered me a temp job that I am working to make into a permanant gig.

It's because of my rep and hard work, but I do not discount that without the lucky breaks that got me the opportunity upon which to capitolize, I might not be in such a good place. What if I didn't know the nice lady at the tattoo shop who helped me out? Or what if I haden't been introduced to the people who ended up calling me and offering me a job this last go 'round?

that's how I feel about it anyway. I have also seen people work very hard and honestly, and get nowhere.

by the same token, in the great depression, some people lost their god damned kids. Had to give them away. I don't ever want to live in a society where that can happen to people willing to work. And it did then.

chavez · RIP MHL 04/25/1958 - 01/11/2006

Faust · Wakeboarder.Commie Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 1496

eeven73 · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 12:09 pm Post subject:

goofyboy · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 12:17 pm Post subject:

chavez · RIP MHL 04/25/1958 - 01/11/2006

eeven73 · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 12:29 pm Post subject:

microman · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 12:29 pm Post subject:

eeven73 · Posted: Sep 30, 2010 12:30 pm Post subject:

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

Okie Boarder · Ladies Man Joined: 03 Mar 2008 Posts: 10056 City: Edmond

chavez · RIP MHL 04/25/1958 - 01/11/2006

jryoung · Ladies Man Joined: 19 Mar 2004 Posts: 7664 City: Man Jose

Danny Noonan: I planned to go to law school after I graduated, but it looks like my folks won't have enough money to put me through college.
Judge Smails: Well, the world needs ditch diggers, too.

Not sure if it is a chicken or the egg argument but it seems that many of the high paying engineering jobs around here are going to immigrants. Not sure if it is because they are better educated, harder working, smarter or all of the above.

We hear all the time how we are falling behind in math and sciences compared to the rest of the world.

Then again, as eeven said