Backroll problem

[WAKENERD]

I landed my first backroll a little over a month ago, but I can't land another one since then. I always under rotate and my friends told me I look as if I were just learning this trick all over again. I'm really frustarted so I want to know if anybody had the same experience before and what u did to overcome it.

[SkapSkippy]

i havent landed one yet but i have the same problem. for me it started out as loosng too much pop off the wake becuase i was throwing it too early but i think i have solved that problem for now. now im under-rotating, my brother tells me to edge in like im going for the flats and ill lad one the downside of the wake. should i be edging in like i am trying to land in the flats. wakenerd, where are you aiming your landing for when you edge in?

[cowdoc13]

WAKENERD

Your question is a comon one on this board. In my experience, being in control at the wake is very important in landing a backroll. I have found that if I feel rushed or out of control leaving the wake, I am out of control in the air and I cannot regain control to land. That being said, I concentrate very hard at doing what I have read on this board many times, having the handle low and in at my waste with my knees slightly bent as I approach the wake. Keeping the board on edge all the way through the top of the wake while standing tall right at the top of the wake. Then keeping the handle close to my waist throughout the rotation while holding on with both hands. In coming to the wake, I think of trying to hit the wake about about 85 - 90 degrees to the direction of the boat pull. I do not even think about trying to initiate the trick by turning my head to my lead shoulder. I start about 10 - 15 feet outside the wake and try to focus on gradually increasing my edge, especially as I go down the trough of the wake and up the wake. It is only as I start down the trough that I think about trying to have the direction of my board at 85 - 90 degrees to the direction the boat is going. Some people try to push the board even further past 90 degrees as they get to the wake. When I do that, I feel out of control and rushed. For me, if I try to take a really hard cut as soon as I cut towards the wake (i.e., cut 90 degrees to the pull of the boat at the begiining of my cut to the wake), I generate too much speed too quickly and I feel totally out of control at the wake and I end up dumping my edge going up the wake and get very little pop. No pop usually means coming up short. As has been said many times, having the board on edge and riding it right off the top of the wake is what is needed to get the pop to get the height one needs to complete the trick. If one rides the board off the top of the wake, on a progressive edge, one cannot stop the board from racing off the wake and going up and behind them like one wants it to for initiating a backroll.

Once off the water, one will feel the rope is super tight from cutting all the way through and off the top of the wake and they will have to resist the pull of the rope. Any time one leaves the wake with a lot of tension on the rope, the handle will get pulled out away from their body. To complete the rotation, one needs to pull on the handle and get it back in close to their waste. As has been said many times, what controls the speed of the rotation on a backroll is the position of the handle. If one lets the handle get away from their body, the rotation slows. If one pulls the handle in closer to their body, the rotation goes a little faster. For me, the challenge was learning to fight the pull of the rope and keep the handle in close for the entire rotation without letting go with my back hand.

My tendency when learning a backroll was to let my rear hand off the handle when I felt the pull of the rope. It was my way of trying to control the rotation. When one lets their rear hand off the handle before the rotation is complete, the rotation stops or slows way down. If one has left the wake with enough line tension and momentum, the board will make it all the way around and come back on the the water, assuming one got a good pop. That is why one can land a backroll one handed. But for me, letting my rear hand come off the handle is one of the two biggest reasons I end up coming up short on my backrolls. While I can now land backrolls one handed, while I was learning them I had a big problem with getting the board back on the water in a position si I could ride away. Because I was letting my back hand come off the handle early in the rotation, my rotation would stop and I would start fall out of the air like a rock about the time I was completing about 80 - 85 % of the rotation. The momentum of the trick would always make the board finish coming around and I would end up on top of the board when it hit the water, but the rope would be really lose. I would be falling back away from the boat trying to regain rope tension. And, the board would slap the water really hard and skip out from under me. When I forced myself to keep both hands on the handle throughout the rotation and I made myself ride the board on edge off the top of the wake, I would complete the rotation and land smoothly.

I have found that when I hit the wake with my board on edge, my handle in at about 3- 4 inches off my waist and just let the board explode off the top of the wake, that all I have to concentrate on after that is keeping the handle in close to my waist and look over my lead shoulder to spot the water for the landing. Once I see the water, I try to tell myself I need to get my head up and turned it to see the shoreline I am going to ride to. Looking to the shoreline as one lands helps keep their body and the board going in the same direction. If one looks to the boat while landing their upper body will try to go with the boat, but the momentum of the board will be headed towards the shore. That makes it hard to land the trick and ride away.

So in my experience and from what I have read, coming up short is the result of one of two things. Trying to throw the trick while riding up the wake (i.e., too early) or letting the handle get too far away from your waist while coming off the wake or while in the air. For me, wanting a trick really badly is what makes me try to make it happen before I reach the top of the wake (i.e., throw it early). What I really have to force myself to do with a backroll is to be really patient at the wake and pretty much let the trick happen by being in a good position as I go up and off the top of the wake. What I mean by that is board on edge and handle in close to my waist. It seems when I do that, the first 3/4 of the trick takes care of itself because everything feels really smooth and in control coming off the water and in the air. After that it is just a matter of my remembering to keep the handle in at my waist as I complete the last 1/4 of the rotation and look to the shore.

Assuming I ride the board on edge off the top of the wake and had the handle in, the next most common thing I do in regards to coming up short is letting my rear hand come off the handle before I have completed the rotation. If I ride the board off the top of the wake and on a strong edge but let my rear hand off the handle before I have completely finished the rotation, I end up coming up just a touch short and feel like I am falling out of the sky. The board is usually under me when it gets back to the water, it is just that I hit with such force that the board bounces and skips out because my body is not in the correct position in relation to the board and I have no line tension to use to correct my body position. Those landings tend to be really hard on my ankles and knees because the board slaps the water very hard and all of the force of the trick seems like it comes right back up through my legs and lower body.

Hope that helps. Sorry for the long post. This is a really common question. Do a search, you will find lots of good suggestions for successfully completing a backroll. Reading posts and riding with an instructor are things that really helped me. What works for some, may not work for others. What seems clear and logical to me, may not be to you. Getting additional input and suggestions from other posts will help you too.

[TDoc]

I know what your saying. Whenever i first started doing backrolls and actually getting close to landing them, i encountered the same problems. As far as for the under rotating thing, it sounds like you are trying to start your rotation before you get your pop. Right when you pop off the wake, start your rotation.. not before.
And for the where should your try to land... what i used to do, is just a normal hs wake to wake jump to get my speed right to land on the backside of the other wake, and then i would go do the backroll with the same speed.
Hope that helps.

[a-shep1190]

if you are under rotating push the handel to the inside of the spin i had the same problem when i lstarted landing my back rolls. make sure that you ride the wake like a quarter pipe and that you spot your landing and keep going in the same direction

[SkapSkippy]

i've also heard people say to cut up and away from the boat off the top of the wake, should i be doing that or just use a progressive edge like a normal HS WTW

[AndyDeeJay]

cowdoc13,

I need rather long winded explanations - this was excellent. I have been riding for years without invert success. I have all varieties of DVD including the book, but when I go out there I always under rotate and crash out. I will try out your tips at W/E

Thanks