Panasonic 3CCD Camcorders

[Randy]

I'm looking at buying a new camcorder for wakeboarding. I know that 3ccd is the best, and I know that you get what you pay for (when its retail). What I don't know is, IS a $600-$700 3ccd camera any good?

Specifically, I'm looking at the Panasonic pv-gs150 and the pv-gs65. The only difference i can find is still shot megapixel. 1.2 vs. 2.3 megapixel.

So, if this is a good camera for wakeboarding, let me know, and my budget is in the 500-$700 range.

Thanks,
Randy

[89comp]

Randy-
Personally I think still shot in a video camera is as useful as camera phones for creating a family album. The 3ccd cameras are the way to go so get the best camera you can for your price range. Then go shoot all you can and have fun.

[89comp]

Randy-
Personally I think still shot in a video camera is as useful as camera phones for creating a family album. The 3ccd cameras are the way to go so get the best camera you can for your price range. Then go shoot all you can and have fun.

[RD]

I think some of the other features like 24p aren't there as well but for wakeboard shooting either of those should be fine. Their is a big difference between a 3 CCD cam and a single, if you want the best color rendition 3 CCDs is a must IMHO. I agree with 89comp on the still function, what good is a 2mp image at that quality. They don't even have that function on the DVX series.

[Tranner]

This is actually something I've been researching for a few weeks now. Go to this site and read some of the reviews. I also thought the still shot was the only difference in the 2 models you listed above until I read this...
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/Panasonic-PV-GS150-Camcorder-Review.htm

Unfortunately, now I want the GS400

[cpferris]

Interesting to read this thread, as I just purchased the PVGS120 at Circuit City for $499 about a month ago. It is a very nice camera...picture quality is much nicer than my old single ccd canon. Unfortunately, I still haven't pulled my boat from storage and had the chance to try it from the boat.

Only knocks on the panasonics that I found when researching are:
1. It cannot record in true 16x9 widescreen format.
2. The EIS system is pretty sketchy.

Speaking from what I have experienced firsthand, the widescreen thing isn't that important to me as I don't have a widescreen set. Only thing I wish it had was more optical zoom.

As for the EIS, I have found that my Pana is no worse than my old Canon (which I always thought was pretty good). I agree wholeheartedly with the others regarding the still image capability. It's garbage. Don't pay extra for that.

I have also already used the camera to transfer to my PC and cut a DVD. Worked pretty well, with no real issues.

Two other real nice features with the Panasonic. First, the tapes load from the top which is nice if you use a tripod. And second, they also have a analog pass-through mode that will allow you to use the camecords as a device to push analog data from say a VCR or older camcorder into your PC for editing and DVD conversion. Haven't gotten to try this yet, but sounds cool to me.

[JamesWatts]

The only cameras that has native 16:9 chips are the XL2, and that is a 4:3 and 16:9 chip so technicaly it is not real 16:9 either. same with the FX1 and Z1U. but they have a HDV which is 16:9

there is really no point in recording in true 16:9 at a consumer/pro-sumer level. if you want the 16:9 look just shoot it in 4:3 and crop your video in post. just keep in mind when you are shooting that you need to keep everything more in the middle of the screen. because you are going to crop it down. even get a dry erase marker and draw guidelines on your LCD if you want.

shooting in 16:9 on these comsumer and pro-sumer cameras blocks off part of the CCD's and gives you less picture quality.


-James

[watsoc]

I just got the PVGS150 and I love it. There are more differences between the 150 and 65 though besides the still camera issue. Probably the biggest difference is the higher quality Leica Dicomar lens. It is a much better lens and is worth the $100 cost difference by itself. You also get a hot shoe on the 150 if you ever want to add a light to help with indoor recording in low light scenarios.

I was able to find mine online at B&H Photo for $600 which is a great buy. 89Comp recommended them to me and they have a very solid rating on resellerrating.com. I agree with everyone that the still camera issue is not something to worry about but it is nice to have a still camera on the camcorder if you don't have your nice digi camera at the same time. I have used it a few times and it seems to work well enough to take some quick shots in a pinch. The 150 also has a flash built in for the camera.

The 3CCD is definately the way to go and it is why I bought the PVGS150 in the first place. The PVGS400 model is probably the best camera available for the money currently but the price was a little too much for me to spend right now at around $1200-1300 range. I would look at B&H Photo or Discount FOTO for the best deal on the 150 and just pull the trigger. I can't wait for it to warm up so I can get some vids of my riding this summer.

[Randy]

Thanks for the info guys. I think I've decided on the gs150.

[-=LoneStar=-]

The only big problem with the PV-GS150, IMO, is that they took away the analog input/pass-through that was there on the PV-GS120.

The other issue is image stabilization. Obviously optical stabilization would be much nicer but that's probably the main reason for the PV-GS250's extra $300. The digital stabilization that is there, however, doesn't seem quite as good as that of some other brands.

I'm not quite convinced of the advantage of the 3 1/6" CCDs because the samples I've seen from some more expensive single 1/4" or 1/3.4" CCD camcorders look just as good. Maybe that's because a single 1/3.4" CCD has more area than 3 1/6" CCDs combined. I'm not sure. Still, from the samples I've seen, I think the 150 probably makes the best video for the price. DAMN that missing analog input though! If it weren't for that, I'd buy one tomorrow since the price of optical stabilization (my other wish) is not likely to come down in the future. As it is though, I might have to wait to see what else comes out and capture my kid's first year on my old Canon ES4000 Hi8 (at least it has nice optical stabilization). The grandparents just won't get video updates on the web, I suppose.

[watsoc]

Lonestar:

The D-EIS on the PVGS150 is actually not that bad. I have used it indoors at night with decent lighting and it appears very steady and the quality looks great. How often are you really using your camcorder in a minimal light situation. The answer for me was never. I agree that an optical stabilization system would be better but the extra cost of the PVGS250 is not worth it, IMO. I don't have any analog issues either because this is my first camcorder. I truly felt the PVGS150 was the best camcorder in this price range and it takes truly amazing video outdoors which is what most wakeboarders will be using it for. I have compared it to my friend's Sony DCR- HC42 ($600 as well) and its color trueness and picture quality is much better. The friend even stated that he really likes the 150 better. If you have a camcorder that is working for you now then you may just want to wait because the 2nd generation of the PVGS400 is likely to be very sweet. The cost will likely be pretty high though. I basically bought the 150 to film my baby girl and take some nice wake vids and the 150 has fit this bill for me perfectly at a cost of $600 which worked well for me and my family.

[-=LoneStar=-]

watsoc,

I think you made a great choice since you don't have any need for analog-in. I really think that might be a deal breaker for a lot of people though. I almost can't believe they left it out. As far as stabilization goes, I'm just going by what I've read. I totally agree, however, that the extra $300 probably isn't worth it for most uses.

The ES4000 that I mentioned is my first camcorder and it has the optical stabilization so I'm probably spoiled in that respect. I got an incredible deal on it in '98 ($400 when the MSRP was over $2K) I guess because people were starting to want digital units and external LCD screens. I didn't really see a reason to pay the digital premium at the time since video editing on home computers of the era would have been ridiculously slow, and I saw the LCD as a battery drain. Now, with current technology, I'm really wanting the ease of all digital production and the permanence of digital media (vs. analog tapes which degrade over time). If only I could find a new "prosumer-level" digital camcorder with optical stabilization, 22X optical zoom, tons of features, and the quality of the ES4000 for $400...

Oh, and watsoc...that last paragraph wasn't really targeted at you. I think I just turned this post into a blog. Sorry.

[PimpinD]

check out any of my recent videos (link in sig.) and it will give u a good idea of what it looks like compressed.

[watsoc]

Lonestar:

I hear ya. I just wanted to state what I did because I read all the reviews as well and the EIS doesn't seem as bad as they state it is. I have never filmed in a completely dark room only light with a few candles though. I do understand the analog conversion issue and it was mentioned in many of the reviews. I hear Sears still has some 120s left that do have that feature however.

It may be tough for you to ever get the type of deal you did on your current camera though. It sounds like you got an unbelievable deal and it at least works for you currently except for the video editing and internet posting issue. I really wanted the PVGS400 but it was more then my wife would let me spend so I settled on the 150 and I am very happy with it so far. I hear you on your dream camcorder as well but you may be waiting a while for that price range.