Is it worth adding Perfect Pass to a bowrider?

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

I've got a 22' Chaparral bowrider. I added a tower last year and am contemplating adding Perfect Pass. I'm in my mid forties, addicted to wakeboarding, but really a beginner. Probably won't get great but want to be able to jump the wake and do 180s, etc. It's very tough to keep my boat at a constant speed of 20-22 mph and I'm told perfect pass will help a lot but I'm wondering about the wake size/shape.

Should I just bite the bullet and buy a wakeboard boat?

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

Yes. I like my boat better than our old bowrider. It sucks in the chop, but when it's choppy we don't ride anyway.

IT depends on what you are willing to sacrafice financially.

DavidHoff · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 9:14 am Post subject:

I would say you should definetely get a wakeboard boat or even any inboard, used or new.

vette74 · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 9:14 am Post subject:

If you want to try to save money buy a 4 or 5 blade prop first, they hold speed a lot better than a 3 blade. It is almost as good as perfect pass.

salmon_tacos · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 10:21 am Post subject:

I agree with vette74. If you have any porpoising problems (which can definitely affect the ability to maintain a constant speed), buy (or make) a hydrofoil stabilizer for the outdrive as well.

Perfect Pass is the stuff though, especially if you're the only one who knows how to drive well! It's fairly easy to get someone to drive straight lines with sharp turns in between (instead of long curving paths). It's harder to get them to focus enough to maintain a steady speed.

Of course, if you've got the dough, you might as well get a wakeboard boat. If for no other reason, do it because it will tend to depreciate less than your I/O. Also, if you haven't ridden a nice vertical wake, try it. You might like it. If you do, I don't know if you'll ever get that out of an I/O. I'm not sure it has so much to do with the choice of drive configurations as it does with coincidental hull design characteristics. All I know is that I/O's, in general, have very rampy wakes.

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

Thanks for the tips! I did add a 4 blade prop last year. It helped a bit, but still tough to keep steady speed. Perfect Pass is $1600 a new boat (including my trade) will probably cost $30,000. I think you guys are correct, PP will hold the speed but the wake will probably never be very good.

DavidHoff · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 10:38 am Post subject:

A new boat would cost $30k+ but you should consider an older 1980's Ski Nautique 2001 for around 5k-10k and with PP, A Tower, and Ballast, your getting a perfectly good wakeboard boat for around 15k give or take a couple. Then again, If you want something newer, you can look at around the year 2000 V-drive wakeboats for 20k-30k.

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

Yeah, I actually meant $30 k plus my trade of around $20k figuring I'd have to spend $50,000. That's why I'm struggling with the decision!

salmon_tacos · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 10:59 am Post subject:

You don't have to spend anywhere close to $50K for a wakeboard boat, regardless of your needs! ...unless you just want it to be fancy.

If your boat is worth $20K, I'd say you could spend anywhere from -$10K to $20K for a boat, depending on your needs (age and size).

In the <$10K range, you have small older boats like a Nautique 2001, Malibu Skier, etc.

Then from $10K-$25K, you've got stuff like a used Sport Nautique, Mastercraft 205, Malibu Sunsetter, etc.

Moving up to $20K-$35K, you've got v-drives like a used Nautique Super Sport, Mastercraft 205V or X-Star, Malibu VLX, Supra SSV, etc. or new Moomba LSV.

Moving up to around $40K, you can get a used Super Air, VLX, X-Star/X-2 or a new Moomba XLV, Sanger 210, Supra SSV, etc.

There are also other less-common brands out there like Centurion, Calabria/Hydrodyne, Gekko, and others.

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 11:28 am Post subject:

Oldman, I actually installed a tower on a new chap' a few weeks ago. it was a lovely boat. from my experiance one of the nicest Sportsboats around.

Also, they are pretty heavy too, this gives you an advantage straight away over others brand slike bayliners, maxums etc.

now you have added a tower, no one will buy the boat that doesn't want to wakeboard, so adding perfect pass would only do good for the saleability and value of your boat.

Personally, i'd invest in the following:
-Perfect pass
-2 fat sacs (one for in the bow area and a set of small ones for the rear.
- Some wakeboard tuition to teach you about the technique and just give you a bit of a push so you can utilise your boat to the max.

This will cost you around 2k and make a huge difference to your boat.

At this point you can use your boat and see how it goes, if you still don't like it then maybe think about selling, but you won't have lost too much money on it - especially if you can beneifit from the upgrades for another year or so Very Happy

I've seen people do this and it transforms their boat (especially with a tower)

Just my 2 cents,

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

Thanks for your thoughts Brit Rider. So, you think the wake is ok (especially if I get the fat sacs) for a beginner/intermediate rider?

Neognosis · Ladies Man Joined: 13 Jan 2003 Posts: 17617 City: Webster

I see many boats today with towers, and their owners rarely wakeboard. It's become the "in" thing to have on your boat around here.

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 11:50 am Post subject:

for sure, the only thing is that the wake is a little wide, but will be plenty big enough with some sacks. which is why i recommend getting a little coaching... just to make sure your edging is dialled totally so you can clear both wakes and get plenty of pop. this will also give you the opportunity to check out a wakeboard boats wake, perfect pass and interior etc...

The thing is, unless you exclusivly wakeboard it may not be worth upgrading the boat yet. the chapparel has a super deep hull and bags of freeboard so your all set for rough water cruising, it would be a shame to sacrifice all of that just for a wake.

hope that helps some Very Happy

baggyman · Soul Rider Joined: 19 Aug 2004 Posts: 331 City: Vegas

i love the questions of "hey what can i do to make my i/o a better wake boat?" because it always gets the response get a wake boat... meaning a inboard. the chapparal is a great boat you dont need a inboard. the extended hull and weight will give you a nice wake for any skill level. put a 650lb sac in the bow and another in the middle of the driver and the passenger and that will fix most of your planing and bowbouncing problems. Aslo have your driver mess with the trim tabs ( for your inboard owners that is the TAPS system on a Tige Smile

) and see where you like the wake. i have ridden behind a 1930 chap and the wake was very nice.

The wake wont be too wide or washed out and you will be out a couple of hundred instead of the hassle of selling your boat and getting another one that is used and may or may not run as well as the one you have now.

anyway just my 1cent worth may not mean anything but i think you have a good boat no need to get another one

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 12:03 pm Post subject:

baggyman, yeha, one of the major facotrs here is that the chap is such a nice boat to start with. real quality construction in my opinion.

but on the 22ft 220 the wake will be a little wide due to the wide beam.

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

This has been extremely helpful. One of the things that I didn't mention was that it is a relatively new boat (2001), it's in great shape (I'm very anal about it) and I've never had a single problem with it. Also, I put in a great sound system a year ago. I just started wondering if I was throwing good money into the wrong type of boat and I wanted to make sure that if I put Perfect Pass in and got some weight I wouldn't have wasted more $.

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 12:07 pm Post subject:

certainly won't be a waste of money.

I board in the ocean and your boat is perfect for many people. for many its just not practical to use a wakeboard boat due to the conditions

baggyman · Soul Rider Joined: 19 Aug 2004 Posts: 331 City: Vegas

how wide is the beam on the 22 foot? isnt the newer 24v's like 8.5 foot beam?

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

The beam is 8'6" or 102 inches

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 12:21 pm Post subject:

yup, it was right ont he limit of 102" for a monster tower, but still looked awesome.

24v? as in a tige? Chap don't do V-drive, only I/O with mercrsuier (Alpha 1, bravo and bravo II, drives)

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

don't know anything about 24v. Chaparral's new boat has the same name as mine, it is the 220 SSI. It's actually 21.5 feet long not including the swim platform. I have an alpha 1 with 5.7 liter mercruiser I/O (260 hp)

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

Forgot to mention. I put a 13th floor tower on it. It's a great tower. Matches the paint color perfectly!

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 12:39 pm Post subject:

haah the 220 ssi is the exact bao ti fitted a monster tower to, the boat was in like the burgundy colour scheme with a polished silver tower.

Either way, that was one of the best I/O's i've ever worked on, fibreglass was super think, carpets and upholstry was pretty good too.

I wouldn't want to go losing that boat of yours Oldman, in any hurry Cool

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

Thanks Brit Rider. My wife says the same thing. I hate it when she's right!

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 1:00 pm Post subject:

Oldman, its always thwe way - wives just ain't ever wrong!
May as well just reply "yes dear" and leave it at that Laughing

salmon_tacos · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 1:08 pm Post subject:

My only advice is that you check out the wakeboard boats that are out there (and the older boats from which they were developed) before you sink too much money into your boat. MOST wakeboard boats (and other inboards) are narrower, have a deeper entry vee, and have a shallower vee at the transom; than MOST I/O's. This makes a narrower and steeper wake that many people prefer. If you haven't tried one, perhaps you should.

Some people are really snobby about inboards saying, "Oh, I/O's suck. Get a real wakeboard boat!" Likewise, some I/O owners are very defensive and would lead you to believe that any I/O will do just as well as any inboard. This is simply not the case. There are differences, coincidental or not, between MOST inboards and MOST I/O's. It's hard to say which is "better" but if you have a wake preference, you'll almost always be much better off with one over the other.

Pictures for comparison: a 22' Chapparal I/O which will produce a wide and rampy wake vs. a Ski Nautique 2001 which will produce a narrow and steep wake (note: a modern wake boat with a steep wake will have a similar shape on the running surface)

Oldman · Newbie Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 16 City: Dallas

Thanks for the photos, that really helped to explain it. Now I'm really confused!

salmon_tacos · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 1:44 pm Post subject:

Don't be confused. Just go ride on some different boats. I got an I/O from my dad before I ever rode behind any other boats. It's a pretty nice boat and it can make a big clean wake. I added a tower to it, a 4-blade prop, and got some fat sacks. All-in-all, it's a pretty good boat for wakeboarding.

Then, however, I started riding behind some wakeboard boats (Super Air, VLX, SSV, XLV, etc.) and found out that I personally prefer a steeper wake. For me, it's just more fun to hit. So, I went out and bought the Nautique that you see in the pictures and I'll soon be selling my I/O.

An I/O with a tower is great choice for A LOT of people. All I'm saying is: Do your research, see what's out there and if the costs are all the same, get what works best for you.

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 1:51 pm Post subject:

salmon_tacos, good point. the the only thing i would say is that i'm pretty sure your "entry V" is in the wrong place on that chapparrel - haven't you placed it a little far back?

On a chapparel the entry V is around 20 degrees, this is about as deeper entry as you can get on a smallish boat, many inboards wakebaord/ski hulls are more like 14 degrees.

salmon_tacos · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 2:01 pm Post subject:

I was just pointing to the prow, in general. It's kind of hard to quantify the entry vee since the hull is a very complex 3-D surface.

Anyway, I've seen stated entry vees of around 30 degrees from Sanger, Tige, and Mastercraft. It seems like most manufacturers don't put that as part of the specifications.

Check out this picture of the Ski Nautique. The line tool in Photoshop tells me that that entry vee is almost exactly 30 degrees.

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 06, 2004 2:40 pm Post subject:

Good point salmon_tacos,

However, as we know, sportsboats plane pretty flat @ around 18-22 mph with a large amountof hull in the water, where as inboards (such as your ski nautique) ride nose up, the actual hull inthe water is not very steep, it spretty flat, which accounts for the rough ride in choppy water.

joedirt00 · Posted: Oct 07, 2004 3:17 am Post subject:

I just wanted to say that this is probably the best thread about wakeboarding an I/O on this site. Since I have an I/O myself I have searched for a lot of this info at one time or another, and the "Get a Wakeboat" response gets really old.
Thanks guys for recohnizing the fact that a wake boat doesn't always fit everyones needs and throwing good info out. Cool

Brit Rider · Posted: Oct 07, 2004 3:31 am Post subject:

I have to agree.. it is refreshing...

joedirt00 · Posted: Oct 07, 2004 4:30 am Post subject:

Anyway to get back on track, I was thinking about a PP for my I/O. I think it make the most sense because of the trim adjustment. once you get up to speed you can start cleaning the wake with your trim without worrying about the throttle. But what happens in the event your motor cavitates from trimming up too much??

Does it go nuts and try over rev your motor? Crying or Very sad

vette74 · Posted: Oct 07, 2004 4:59 am Post subject:

joedirt00, If you trim it up that much then you are putting too much stress on your outdrive. The outdrive is not designed to operate under a lot of power while the trim is up. For my alpha 1 outdrive I don't think you should run under signifigant power with the outdrive more than a 1/4 of the way up.

Do you have a hydrofoil on your boat?