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Tower Material and HIEM(SP?) questions

 
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Longhornfan
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PostPosted: Oct 10, 2005 1:48 pm    Post subject: Tower Material and HIEM(SP?) questions Reply with quote

Hey everyone. This is my first post so thanks in advance to any responses. I just bought a 99 bayliner this summer and also became hooked on wakeboarding. I've ridden behind my father-in-laws boat with a pylon and seen the difference having your rope tied high. I've decided to build a wake tower and was curious about which materials I should use. My friends who are going to help me with bending the pipes and the welding and all that good stuff have told me I should go with aluminum because it's lighter and will be easier to bend. Also, what's the Hiem joint I keep seeing mentioned in other post? I have a friend who works at a machine shop that could probably make them for me if I knew what they were. Anything else I've forgotten to ask about or other tips would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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wesgardner
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PostPosted: Oct 11, 2005 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Longhornfan,

First, welcome to the sport and welcome to the site! There's alotta info floating around here...

Heim (I'm not sure on spelling either) is a type of universal joint. In a tower application, it'll allow mounting the "feet" at any angle. For you, they MAY not be necessary as you could get the angle of your deck and make up a "foot" or base plate that'll match exactly....However, the heim comes into play as it'll allow some flexing of the tower and won't transfer that flex to your deck thus cracking it...that said and not to ding Bayliners at all (you get alot for the $), you'll need to reinforce the underside of the deck where the tower bases are bolted. I'd use aluminium as the material of choice...as you've suggested, it's lighter....I'm not a welder but am a boatbuilder...don't know if it takes more sophistication to do good alu. work or not, god only knows I've seen some really bad stuff...so the material will have to be your choice based on your welder's skill set. Check out Bill's (of Monster Tower fame) diy web site, I think it's diytower.com or something similar.

Keep us posted (with pics of course) and check out the SEARCH function for other folks' tower projects as well as ballast systems (you'll want to work on your wake)

Peace

Wes

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Vampyre
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PostPosted: Oct 11, 2005 5:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome to the group.
What type of Bayliner did you get?
I have a 99 Bayliner 185 SS.
I have installed a Monster Tower, and run about 750 lbs or so of ballast in the bow walkway, and about 330 in the ski locker.
If you have any questions about setting up the bayliner, feel free to PM me, or email me.
Chris

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Vampyre
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PostPosted: Oct 11, 2005 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check this thread:
http://forums.wakeboarder.com/viewtopic.php?t=44370

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Longhornfan
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PostPosted: Oct 11, 2005 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a 99 Capri 1950. No joke about working on the wake. That's pretty much all I did this summer. Seems the best way to get ballast is load up with about seven drinking buddies and their gf's. I think I've figured out a way to do the tower without too much welding. I think my biggest problem's goin' to be mounting hardware. I.E. What to use and where to get it. I went by a marina here in Wichita today, where I bought my board, and the don't sell the hardware. Suggestions? Figure I'll try a couple more marinas over the phone tomorrow or worse come to worse try to get some help from a friend that works at a machine shop. Thanks for the replies guys. I'll definitely get pictures up once I get it goin' but with my schedule , and budget Sad ,it might be after Christmas.
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Longhornfan
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PostPosted: Nov 17, 2005 9:06 am    Post subject: 6061 t6? Reply with quote

Hey Everyone,
Found my heim joints for about 12$ each. They're 5/8" with about a 8.5k lb.s break point so I'm guessin' that should be plenty strong. I'm going to try to find some pit pins today so I can break it down without using wrenches. Went to get my aluminum and the guy told me he wouldn't guarantee that what he had could be bent so I figured I'd hit y'all up for some more help.
What he has is 1.5" .25" wall. I could go with 2". The thing is he said it was 6061t6 or 6160t6. Can't remember for sure if the 61 came first or the 60 but it definitely ended in t6. I guess that has to do with how it was tempered.
Anyway's, didn't want to drop the 70 or 80 bucks if I wasn't sure I could use it. If someone in "The Know" can help me with this I can go get it today.
I've got a friend at a machine shop that says he can get it bent and welded for me so hopefully I'll have it done pretty soon. Of course with this guy I might be getting ready to sell my boat 'fore he ever calls me back.
Thanks in advance for any replies.
Hook'Em
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joedirt00
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PostPosted: Nov 17, 2005 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is some grades of aluminum that wont bend really well. I'm not sure which it is. MonsterTower's website states they use 6063-t6.

If there is any doubt I would wee if you could get a old of a piece of scrap from them and do a test bend to make sure that it will work out for you.


I would have thought that enough tubing to do a tower would be way more than 70-80 bucks Confused

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Longhornfan
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PostPosted: Nov 17, 2005 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm going to be getting 3 12' pieces of 1.5" with 1/4" wall at 1.85/ft plus about 4' of 2" with 1/4" wall for about 2 bucks a foot. Thanks for the reply man.
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ace__05
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PostPosted: Nov 18, 2005 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What the aluminum supplier was correct. It is very hard to bend .25" wall thickness aluminum without cracking it. It would be better to move up to 2" with a .125" (1/8") wall thickness.
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Longhornfan
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PostPosted: Nov 20, 2005 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Ace. Do you know about the 6061T6though?
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Brit Rider
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PostPosted: Nov 20, 2005 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Longhornfan, I was told that T6 is not ideal to bend as T6 means it is already tempered to a T6 standard... if you bend it then residual stresses will remain in the pipe. Tempering after bending is better but i doubt its an option for you. having said that though i am quite sure people DO bend T6 pipe.. I know that Monster Tower bends and then tempers its aluminum but other builders do not.

Might be an idea to pay a few bucks to a guy who knows metal to evaluate your designs and recommend the best materials to use.

Just my 2 cents...

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Brit Rider
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PostPosted: Nov 20, 2005 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Double post... excuse me Very Happy
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ace__05
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PostPosted: Nov 21, 2005 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, I was talking about T6. And Brit Rider is correct. It is possible to bend T6, and you'd probably not have any problems with it (some manufacturers do this), but for maximum strength and quality it is better to not buy T6 and then temper the aluminum after you have bent/weld everything.
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Fishmaster
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PostPosted: Dec 15, 2005 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With T6 temper you need to keep the bend radius large or you'll start to see the surface of the aluminum on the outside of the bend "lookin ugly" (spalling, galling??? - I know thier is a more intelligent sounding name for it). Most factory towers start with 6063-T6 or -T54 so stay with what the factorys are doing and you should be fine.

We had to start with mill finish or we could never get the bends in the top section of the tower, also it's a whole lot less expensive then finished and tempered tubing.

Also check out www.diytower.com for ideas and there are pads/bases/etc for sale on eBay that would help speed up building a tower.

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