05' subject or substance

RLrider · Newbie Joined: 25 Mar 2005 Posts: 10

i rode an 04 substance 134 all last season and i want to get a new ride this season either substance 138 or the subject 137 how much different do they ride, i am 140 lbs and i ride advanced int so like 3 or 4 diff. inverts, 3's and 5's stuff like that but im going all out this year i am going to try to move up to expert.

Liquid*Force*Rider · Posted: Apr 06, 2005 10:36 am Post subject:

RLrider, Do you want a fast board, or a slow board.

Bowen · Posted: Apr 06, 2005 11:00 am Post subject:

RLrider, Well you know how the substance rides...I love mine. Demo the Subjekt, and decide for yourself...from what you wrote you seem like a competent enough rider to know the feeling you like.

wakedude83 · Posted: Apr 06, 2005 11:24 am Post subject:

Hey whats up, I think you would probably like to stay with the substance. I've ridden it for a few years and i thought the subjekt felt kinda weird. I also felt like i had more control on the substance, and the subjekt felt unpredictable to me. It's a good board, but if you like the substance, you might not like the subjekt as much. Just my opinion.

cwaker4 · Soul Rider Joined: 09 Dec 2004 Posts: 465 City: Gilroy

well i throw in a vote for the subjekt, i have the 137 and im happy with it. it took a little while to get used to because it didnt really ride like my previous board, but im totally happy with it. its fast into the wake and has insane pop. everyone says that its too loose, and it is loose enough to butter around when freeriding, but it really locks in when you get it on edge.

wakedude83 · Posted: Apr 06, 2005 3:07 pm Post subject:

i'm just saying that if you rode the substance, the subjekt might feel weird for a while. obviously, if you had not ridden the substance for a long time, you would not notice how it feels completely different.

subjekt137R · Newbie Joined: 24 Mar 2005 Posts: 28

Subjekt all the way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

alafiaboarder · Posted: Apr 07, 2005 5:51 am Post subject:

i prefer the substance because i feel that i have more control over it. subjekt feels too loose but its fun to mess around on and it does pop like hell, if u like the substance, u most likely wont like the subjekt when you first ride it but 1 word....demo

sandvign · Newbie Joined: 13 Oct 2004 Posts: 37 City: Fort Dodge

I'd say it totally depends on your riding style. I ride the 05 Substance and love it! I chose it over the Subject when I demoed the Subject I felt like it was too loose for my style. Whereas my buddy who rides a Subject rode my new board and didnt like it much cause it didn't fit his style. If you ride the Substance now and like it, I'd say stick with it. But if you want a change, go for the Subject.

jkerce · Outlaw Joined: 29 Jul 2003 Posts: 131 City: narcoossee, fl

dude the subject is alittle more mellow while the substance is alittle faster but i like the subject ive rode the 04 subject and was sic.

Enzoborder230 · Posted: Apr 07, 2005 5:09 pm Post subject:

LFADAM · Posted: Apr 07, 2005 5:59 pm Post subject:

ar230border, Yes.

Subjekt=loose, crazy pop
substance= medium looseness, and good pop/just a tad less than subjekt.

Enzoborder230 · Posted: Apr 07, 2005 6:38 pm Post subject:

huh i thought the subject was more locked in, what size fins does it have

seedickride · Criminal Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 97 City: Munich, ND

First off, as you can see above, different riders have different takes on both the Substance and the Subjekt. The Subjekt is definitely more locked in when up on edge, and faster to the wake on edge. It will be looser when flat (unless you ride the Substance without the center fin). The Subjekt does have a little more kick off the wake, but I wouldn't say it's harder to control (it's just got a different feel). You won't know what YOU think about the Subjekt unless YOU ride it. We sponsor 3 riders- one has always ridden the Subjekt, another always the Substance, and the last started with the Subjekt and is now on the Sustance. The first 2 would ride either, but feel more confortable on the one they've chosen saying it's the best for them. The last guy says he likes both and wanted to change it up this year. I just say that to emphasize that I'm sure you'll probably have a definite opinion of your own, but won't know which one is for you for sure until you ride the Subjekt. If you absolutely can't ride the Subjekt before buying, (1)it feels faster than the Substance (2)it edges harder (3)it's looser when flat (4)it has more vertical kick off the wake

LFADAM · Posted: Apr 08, 2005 4:58 am Post subject:

ar230border, Im not sure, it has 4 cupped side fins. Probably like .7 inches. Substance has molded side fins which are small. Like angled fins about .7 inches but much less hold than substancee and a center which is a long base 1 inch I think.

cwaker4 · Soul Rider Joined: 09 Dec 2004 Posts: 465 City: Gilroy

seedickride, i agree wth what you said about the subjekt, it edges hard into the wake, and has mass verticle pop. i had to lay off my normal edge the first time rode my subjekt to get used to it.

Enzoborder230 · Posted: Apr 08, 2005 6:52 pm Post subject:

i just thought like the substance was kinda made to be ridden finless mostly

seedickride · Criminal Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 97 City: Munich, ND

The Substance is made to ride either way, depending on rider preference. So, if you compare the Substance without the center fins directly to the Subjekt, the Subjekt is definitely going to feel quicker and more aggressive. I really think that the Subjekt gets too much bad press about it having a "loose ride". Yes, it is loose on center, but how often do you ride it flat?

garrett720 · Posted: Apr 14, 2005 9:48 am Post subject:

I ride the subjekt finless. The feel of the subjekt finless is awesome. If you know how to edge you dont even need fins. I think it lays pretty much the same edge when I get on it without fins as it does with fins. Yes it is loose when you are just riding straight but who rides just straight, you are always laying edges back and forth. I just tried the absolute without the fins and I loved the toeside edge it had, but it just wasnt loose enough. If you want a looser feel and still have a awesome edge, go with the Subjekt. I land all my inverts under control without the fins. Does anyone know if there is any other board that I would like better than the subjekt for my ridings style?

BurntOrangeWake · Outlaw Joined: 22 Sep 2004 Posts: 173 City: Austin

nobody has discussed landings on these boards. i have the same dilemma so i'm curious about the landings on both...

Ctipping · Posted: May 08, 2005 6:08 pm Post subject:

I own both, and the landings on the subjekt are a bit harder, but thats given with the insane pop. The substance gives you a mellower more relaxed feeling riding around and softer landings...The subjekt kind of made me feel stressed to go bigger and ride hard all the time, so it puched me, but the substance is just flowy and sometimes I like to just carve around and think like I'm surfing....I would compare the subjekt to a short board and the substance to a long board....

juiced4ever · Outlaw Joined: 11 Mar 2003 Posts: 212 City: Truckee

I too ride the subjekt and love it. I have gotten one of the subjekts every year since i started riding for LF in 02. The board is getting better and crazier every year. especially since last year when the deck became sculpted. The 137 will ride the .9 cupped fins. I ride the 141 but the 1.2's that come on it bite to much so i ride it with .9's. It is fast like the team and the Balance but with way more pop and lands harder with the huge flat spot on it.