help with Scarecrow

Amy · Criminal Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 92 City: State College

I have my TS Frontrolls dialed pretty consistently...I tried a scarecrow for the 1st time yesterday, everyone on the boat said they looked a lot like my TS FR. I only turned about 45 degrees when I pulled the rope to my left hip, ( I am goofy-footed). When I practice these on the tramp, I take off like a TS FR and pull the handle into my back hip and the trick looks fine. Has anyone had this problem or does anyone have any tips on the take off? Is the take off one hand or two?
Thanks in advance!
AMy

J_DOGG · Posted: Jul 06, 2004 3:49 am Post subject:

To get the 180 going a bit sooner, look under your lead arm more instead of just down like you probably do for the straight F-roll.

Amy · Criminal Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 92 City: State College

OK. I will try tucking my head under on Thurs. Thank you!
For the take off, would you suggest one hand or two? For most of the s-crows I see, they have two hands on the handle throughout the entire rotation...

colefooter · Posted: Jul 06, 2004 10:20 am Post subject:

i let go with my hand that will allow me to go switch easier,which is letting go with your right hand if goofy, other way if regular. let go about 3/4 way through the rotation

J_DOGG · Posted: Jul 07, 2004 8:56 am Post subject:

I use two hands 99% of the time. The only time I let go is when I try to go for the grab but even then it's mid rotation and or to do the hand check when landing....

Stephan · Guest

You have more control if you hold on w/ both hands. Try popping and looking up and over your lead shoulder. That should get the rotation around. It's basically off the wake & then the rest of the trick is just holding on. Make sure you take it up more than out! Kudos on doing em though, you rock!!

Amy · Criminal Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 92 City: State College

Thanks for the tips everyone! I am riding tomorrow, so I will try again.
Stephan, would you suggest looking over or under your lead shoulder???
Most have suggested under.... just wondering if you've had better results with looking over the left shoulder...
So if I break it down....does this sound about right?

1. Pop like on TS FR, (trip flip)
2. After pop, look over (or under??) lead shoulder
3. Look for landing
4. ride away switch

Stephan · Guest

I would definately look over your shoulder. If you were to look under then that would mean you are throwing the trick down. You wanna take the trick up and keep the handle low, if you bring the handle up it will slow your rotation & make it harder to rotate.

In this video there are two clips of me doing crows, one grabbed one not.
http://photos.wakeboarder.com/showphoto.php?photo=4115&password=&sort=2&thecat=500

Amy · Criminal Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 92 City: State College

Stephan
Thanks for the video link--it helps me to visualize a lot better.
The way you do your S-crow is the way I'd like to do mine--more up and over...great video by the way!!!
Thanks again,
Amy

J_DOGG · Posted: Jul 08, 2004 3:54 am Post subject:

Stephan, How do you do a the roll part if you never drop the head????

I'm confused please explain.

Stephan · Guest

It's a trip flip. Basically you have a hard edge and then flatten off. You pop up and then rotate around the handle. Think about it, when you throw a tantrum do you throw your head down? No, you go up and over & eventually your head ends up below your feet. I didn't say don't drop your head, I said don't look under your lead arm. But if you throw your head down you will end up like the picture of the guy with his head only in the water on the General Discussion. You gotta Pop this one & take it up.

BigTimer · Posted: Jul 08, 2004 9:32 am Post subject:

Stephan- I can see what you are saying. But when teaching someone how to do a Scarecrow, I don't think the best advice would be to tell them to look up and over their shoulder. It makes sense to me, it's how you maximize your pop on the trick, but when your just learning it, it might get a little confusing. You can easily get good pop and take it wake to wake by looking under your lead shoulder, that is how I learned it and have always taught people to do it. (granted you need to wait for the pop). Plus this will speed up the Roll part of the trick and set you up to complete the 180 and land the trick.

Besides that, the most important tip I can give you is to keep the handle low and to your hip. A LOT of people have a tendency to let the handle get up near their head on this trick and that makes it a lot tougher to land and a lot more ugly. 2 hands on the handle all the way through the trick unless you are grabbing it.

Good Luck

Stephan · Guest

I don't see how it's any more confusing. It seems more confusing to to throw it down, personally. Isn't it best to learn the trick the right way instead of having to relearn it down the road. Maximize your pop on all tricks. Go big! Either way, do whatever you want and whatever works for ya.

J_DOGG · Posted: Jul 09, 2004 6:46 am Post subject:

Stephan, I was thinking exactly what BigTimer, said...

I always assume "ride up the wake and wait for the pop" that's a given...

Your Tantrum analogy is flawed or shouldn't have been applied the way you did. Cuz yes, as you say "your head goes up and over" but thats the rotation of the trick (Tantrum) lead with the head and the body will follow. For the the crow or front roll for that matter you need to lead with the head so the body will follow. So in a way your analogy just enforced the fact that the head needs to go down first.

When you say look over the should first you do the sbend style crow and those should not be the first ones people learn. As BigTimer, mentions the rope gets away from you and you get all laid out and it's real hard to get your feet back under you.

I'll quote Mr.. senior Murray "A good crow looks like you just came out of a switch front flip". letting the handle out a getting all laid out wont put you in that position.

Like you said "what ever works", I'm not tryn to argue I just wanted you to clarify what you said above so I understood what you implied.

IMO- looking down first is the proper way to do a crow... That's the right way!

Stephan · Guest

No I stand by my tantrum analogy. When I do a scarecrow I do it very similarly to how I do a tantrum, I take it up & over. Obviously they are different but the analogy works. When I say look over your shoulder I mean taking your pop and driving up with your entire upper body to get as high as possible. Obviously you have to drop your head to rotate arond the handle. What I'm trying to encourage is taking the trick up off the wake whereas I feel that dropping your head down & looking under your arm off the wake will lead a lot of people to leave early and not maximize their pop. This is what happened as I learned it, I was too worried about the rotation. Eventually I realized that the trick is at the wake, if you charge and flatten and drive up the trick complete itself. J Dogg I'm interested to see what you think of my crows in the video.

J_DOGG · Posted: Jul 09, 2004 9:24 am Post subject:

Nice vid... I saw it when you posted it the first time....

I only saw two crows, one grabbed and one with two hands on the handle.
You don't want to know what I think, cuz it don't matter, right?

I don't grab my crows so I can't say smack, but I know I can do them right or wrong and still land them... I don't want people to leave the wake early either but when they do the first thing that should happen to initiate the roll is to drop the head.

Look down, look around, it don't matter the body follows the head.

Amy · Criminal Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 92 City: State College

Ok. I've been trying and trying these, and I can't seem to get TS FR off of my brain. Even on the ones I concentrate on looking to spin, they just don't. and ends up looking like a TS F roll. Is my approach wrong for the s-crow? You are supposed to trip flip this trick right? My problem is that I can't seem to get the board behind me, (the people in the boat say,), I'm more up and over...but if I really yank the handle to my back hip, it should naturally bring the board around switch right???? Has anyone else had this problem or know what to do to correct??

Any advice would be reallly appreciated...

loomosity · Outlaw Joined: 10 Mar 2004 Posts: 103

How good are your switch heel landings? I was always sliding out/buttchecking until I realized that I wasn't comfortable doing a toe 180 out in the flats. If you can't do that, how are you supposed to land it coming off a flip? So, I practiced those, emphasized landing on my heel edge edging away from the boat (rather than on my toes). And, bingo, the crow came shortly thereafter.

If you can't get over a frontroll, would it help to keep two hands on the rope or, at least, drop your front hand? I can't imagine landing a frontroll with two hands on the rope.

JKing · Criminal Joined: 06 Jun 2004 Posts: 71 City: Orlando

Hey Amy, it helps me to let go with my lead hand (just past half way through the flip), that way I dont hafta think about pulling to my rear hip and the rotaion feels more natural, plus it leaves a free hand for a grab once you get comfy with em.

Oh, and not to get you guys stirred up again but I go up and over after the pop, never throw down (unless it a hs mexi flip).

Amy · Criminal Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 92 City: State College

Thanks for all of your help everybody! I came super close today, (didn't actually ride away, but the rotation is MUCH better than before! I find myself visualizing this move constantly...it's will be so satisfying to land!
Many thanks again!